250 Ti vs 4345?

[Vettedrummer]

Originally Posted by Vintage Pete

I will just chime in here....

Dan.....your assessment of these two (actually three) JBL systems is excellent, and right on the mark. I would just add that, in actuality, the JBL B460 subwoofer that I have was actually designed to compliment the L250 Loudspeaker system, predecessor of the 250ti).

So to Cornholio's point, I wouldn't for a moment hesitate to recommend that, rather than "upgrade" the beautiful 250ti, that he consider the addition of a B460 Sub (along with the BX63 or BX63A active crossover). Not to slight at all the 43 series-as they are excellent-but if all he is really looking for is a bass improvement, and likes the 250ti otherwise (and who wouldn't) then the B460 would be just the ticket...if he can find one. It may take a little while to find one, but will be well worth the wait. There can be do doubt the synergy between the 250ti and the B460 would be excellent. After all the 250ti, with its improved network and titanium dome tweeter, was a refinement of one of Greg Timber's finest accomplishments, the L250. Of course, the B460 will require a separate amplifier....but he will also gain here from the additional headroom and lower IM from both his amplifiers and his main loudspeakers. He also has to allow physical room for the B460, but if he can pull it off, he will be very pleased, I am quite sure.

Cornholio.....good luck in your quest! See attached Brochures.



Pete

The B460 will not be as hard to find as the BX63 or 63A. Good luck on that one. You can check on the Lansing Heritage web site as I believe there is a thread there that tells you how to build the BX 63. If bass is what you seek, that's the way to get it without dumping the 250Ti's. The other way to go is to pick up a pair of JBL L-300's that will give you the bass, but if you like the high end parts of the 250Ti's then this would be a bad idea as the L-300 gives you the sound that JBL was known for back in the day. When they came out with the Ti series of speakers it was like a different company built them as the sound they put out was so very different. I've talked to several guys over the years about how to rework the crossover in the 250Ti to make it behave more like the JBL's of old. I've never done it, but I have thought about it many times. I was never really happy with the sound the 250Ti's make, but I love the cabinets. The sound is so much like the McIntosh LS-360's that it makes you wonder if Mac didn't use the 250Ti as the model for what they wanted their speaker to sound like. As for me I'm happy JBL went to Synthesis because I love the horns when JBL does it the right way. K2! This time it's the right way.

[MisterBritt]

Originally Posted by Vettedrummer

The B460 will not be as hard to find as the BX63 or 63A. Good luck on that one. You can check on the Lansing Heritage web site as I believe there is a thread there that tells you how to build the BX 63. If bass is what you seek, that's the way to get it without dumping the 250Ti's. The other way to go is to pick up a pair of JBL L-300's that will give you the bass, but if you like the high end parts of the 250Ti's then this would be a bad idea as the L-300 gives you the sound that JBL was known for back in the day. When they came out with the Ti series of speakers it was like a different company built them as the sound they put out was so very different. I've talked to several guys over the years about how to rework the crossover in the 250Ti to make it behave more like the JBL's of old. I've never done it, but I have thought about it many times. I was never really happy with the sound the 250Ti's make, but I love the cabinets. The sound is so much like the McIntosh LS-360's that it makes you wonder if Mac didn't use the 250Ti as the model for what they wanted their speaker to sound like. As for me I'm happy JBL went to Synthesis because I love the horns when JBL does it the right way. K2! This time it's the right way.

Excellent correspondence. Very interesting. Just to touch base on your closing remarks, you are obviously happy with the horns in the Synthesis K2!. I am still contemplating the best way to audition a pair. Meanwhile, I am encouraged by your remarks. I've never owned horn speakers but the ones I have heard sounded like horns. You say the Synthesis line overcomes this perception? Just wondering if you had more to say about it, please. Thanks.

[Vintage Pete]

Originally Posted by Vettedrummer

The B460 will not be as hard to find as the BX63 or 63A. Good luck on that one. You can check on the Lansing Heritage web site as I believe there is a thread there that tells you how to build the BX 63. If bass is what you seek, that's the way to get it without dumping the 250Ti's. The other way to go is to pick up a pair of JBL L-300's that will give you the bass, but if you like the high end parts of the 250Ti's then this would be a bad idea as the L-300 gives you the sound that JBL was known for back in the day. When they came out with the Ti series of speakers it was like a different company built them as the sound they put out was so very different. I've talked to several guys over the years about how to rework the crossover in the 250Ti to make it behave more like the JBL's of old. I've never done it, but I have thought about it many times. I was never really happy with the sound the 250Ti's make, but I love the cabinets. The sound is so much like the McIntosh LS-360's that it makes you wonder if Mac didn't use the 250Ti as the model for what they wanted their speaker to sound like. As for me I'm happy JBL went to Synthesis because I love the horns when JBL does it the right way. K2! This time it's the right way.

Very interesting post....I too love the cabinets of the L250/250ti but I am still very happy with my L220A's, with that JBL sound of old, together with the B460.

I've yet to hear any of the synthesis line, and I'm always moved when I see a picture of the K2 S9900. These are gorgeous speakers, have essentially the same footprint as my L220's, and are the correct height as well. These I believe would fit into my room well.

The price of admission is quite another matter, however....


Pete

[jdandy]

Originally Posted by Vintage Pete

Very interesting post....I too love the cabinets of the L250/250ti but I am still very happy with my L220A's, with that JBL sound of old, together with the B460.

I've yet to hear any of the synthesis line, and I'm always moved when I see a picture of the K2 S9900. These are gorgeous speakers, have essentially the same footprint as my L220's, and are the correct height as well. These I believe would fit into my room well.

The price of admission is quite another matter, however....

Pete.......Come on Powerball!

[Vintage Pete]

Originally Posted by jdandy

Pete.......Come on Powerball!

Tell me about it Dan....I do keep trying!


Pete

[Markd51]

Comparing the L-300 to the 4345 would almost be like comparing a pair of Bose Acoustimass to a pair of Wilson Audio Grand Slamms.

They weren't really known as a sound reinforcement speaker, they were a Studio Monitor, and only 500 pair were ever made.

One could probably buy 5 pairs of 250Ti's to one pair of mint 4345 speakers. Figure an easy $10K for a pair right now.

I know I can't post links, otherwise I'll be slapped, but somebody like Kenrick Sound in Japan will either get you a pair of mint-reconditioned 4345, or they'll custom build you a pair!

If you wanna see some really serious JBL's, and some state of the art clones, take a little peek over there. But be ready to have your mind blown. Mark

[Markd51]

I'd like to add, that perhaps I might be mistaken, that I'm somehow dissing the L-300 Summit.

It was a beauty, this was of course back in the heyday of JBL, when quality products were made right here in good ole USA.

In fact I was ready to trade 4 one year old JBL L-65 Jubals for 4 L-300s, (they were $1050 ea to me at the time) and get every cent back in trade ($400ea) for my L-65's, and that day I heard a brand new pair of L-300's, I kept my 4 Jubals. And I still have them, as well as a mint pair of 4430 Monitors.

One thing about some of these speakers, there were many that were first debuted as the original model, then an A model, then a B model. The L-65 was like that, as well as the L-200, and L-300.

If memory serves me correctly, some L-300's came with the 136A 15" Woofer, and some came with the 2235H. There were other differences as well, to X-Over, etc.

I actually liked the L-200 better than the L-300. Even though the L-300 had the magical 077 Tweeter. The L-300 was like a Jubal on Steroids, instead of the LE5-5 like the Jubal had, the L-300 had the Horn, and a larger 15" Bass Driver. With the 136A Woofer, I thought the L-300 was flabby, and loose sounding down low, compared the the L-65.

IMO, the 4430 stomps the L-300. And the 4345, which I heard once, as well as others like the 4343, 4331, 4350 all stomp the L-300 with no trouble.

None the less, all I have mentioned were really nice speakers, I certainly wouldn't throw none of them out in the trash! Mark

[Cornholio]

A guy I know from a russian audiophile forum just replaced his B&W 800 Diamonds and Tannoy Canterburys with Kenrick made 4345 and cannot be happier. He says the speakers are in another league completely and that he never heard sound like that.

[Vintage Pete]

Those are beauties for sure....I can well imagine how happy he must be.

Pete

[jdandy]

Cornholio........Looks like some nice Esoteric gear in his rack, too.