JL Gotham City?

[doggiehowser]

I have been told the dual driver JL subs are designed to handle mid and low bass separately but designed to be aligned/in phase.

Some have said that the midbass on the f113s aren't as good as the dual driver JL but to be honest, they sound more than adequate to me. It could be because I run a full range front L/R speaker setup (including 2 matching stereo subs running in augment mode ie not connected to LFE) and these provide enough mid bass.

For music, I still prefer a stereo sub setup (next to the mains). If I had to make do with a single subwoofer for stereo music, I would need it to be in the centre directly between the two L/R speakers. In a combined HT setup, with a centre speaker and the screen, it might make for a tough fit (screen would be placed too high and at an odd viewing angle), especially if you get the stacked dual driver JL

[GaryProtein]

Originally Posted by doggiehowser

I have been told the dual driver JL subs are designed to handle mid and low bass separately but designed to be aligned/in phase. . . . .

I don't think you need a subwoofer to handle "midbass". That should be the job of the main speakers. Two octaves below middle C is 65 Hz. If that's what you consider midbass, your mains should probably be playing that in a 2 channel system. In a home theater, that may be played by the subs.

Where did you hear the two drivers in the dual driver JL subs handle different frequencies? Paging Ivan . . . .

[JL John]

I honestly have a feeling that for 2 channel I would be plenty happy with a pair of f112s for the music I like (jazz, blues, some classic rock) and a Gotham in back for supplemental lfe in ht.

I was curious about the Gotham because many a great deal have been popping up and I was trying to gauge the opinions on the Gotham

[Masterlu]

Originally Posted by GaryProtein

I don't think you need a subwoofer to handle "midbass". That should be the job of the main speakers. Two octaves below middle C is 65 Hz. If that's what you consider midbass, your mains should probably be playing that in a 2 channel system. In a home theater, that may be played by the subs.

Where did you hear the two drivers in the dual driver JL subs handle different frequencies? Paging Ivan . . . .

That's a first, never heard that one.

[doggiehowser]

Maybe midbass is the wrong description. The best way to describe it is using both a JL f110 and a f113 at the same time.

The f110 sounds different than the f113 with a more audible bass vs the f113's more tactile bass. The boom vs the rumble effect.

The thing is that it's difficult hard to integrate 2 subwoofers in a room because of cancellation, phase or alignment. The 212s take the guesswork out.

[GaryProtein]

It's actually easier to integrate two subs than one because the bass is more balanced throughout the room because it comes from more than one source.

I never listened to an F110 so I can't make any comparative statements regarding them.

The F212's are really just more of a good thing, but they are still a single source. Given a choice, I would get two F112s instead of one F212 because you can separate them. The only advantage I see with the F212 is you get two woofers in the footprint of one F112.

[doggiehowser]

I dunno.. two subs means more potential for cancellations/reinforcements etc.

But if it's in a stereo setup and placed alongside the mains, the bass is usually less lopsided than a single sub in a corner.

[GaryProtein]

A single sub doesn't need to be in a corner and will sound better if located "more in the room".

[redm]

Originally Posted by GaryProtein

A single sub doesn't need to be in a corner and will sound better if located "more in the room".

I sometimes can hear the lopsided effect since I'm using mismatched subs. All the manuals I've read recommend subs near walls for improved effect. When you say 'more in the room' do you mean away from the wall or into the room and away from any wall? If its the latter can you explain?

[GaryProtein]

Yes, I mean being away from the walls will give a smoother bass response. A good sub will have sufficient power to still give a lot of punch.

As I have posted before, if a sub is not well integrated, one or more of the following are to blame:

1--the crossover point it too high and you have too much overlap between the mains and subs causing a frequency bump
2--the crossover point is too low and the mains don't extend low enough to meet the subs and you have a frequency gap
3--the crossover slope is too steep and you have have a gap between the mains and the subwoofer because the mains "roll-off" does not complement the "roll-on" of the sub.
4--the crossover slope is to shallow and you have to much overlap between the main woofer and subwoofer
5--the sub volume is too loud relative to the main speakers
6--the sub volume is too soft relative to the main speakers