Moon P8RS _ W7MRS

[TOGA]

epic, I never heard 710, only 700 mono. Yes, they're as you said, very fast, controlled and transparent. but 700 will cost me too much. 710 has too little power. I like 700, but $$$ is too much and it has incompatibility low input impedance to work with my ARC tube pre amp.
Toga

[epic]

Toga,

The 710 has very similar sound character of what you heard in the 700, probably 710 is just a tad more neutral, only side by side the 710&700 will give it away but all other positive virtues are there.
Of cos raw power cannot be compared to the 700 monos, but 710 has huge current of 60A like the 700 monos and they may drive the Q3 quite well.
That is if you have the chance to trial the 710 in your own place, sure do take that chance before jumping to other similar priced level amplifiers.

All the best and enjoy..

Cheers

[TOGA]

epic,

Big problem is that my Ref40 pre amp cannot drive amp that have such a low input impedance. I am very much enjoy sound of Ref40, but it is limit choice of
amplifier too much. Some great amps that incompatible with it due low input impedance are
Burmester 911m3, Gryphon, Soulution, TBC. I will invest heavily on my new disc player soon, so this new amp/preamp project is quite far into the future, and now I think Ref40 and Moon W7M are working together very well.
Toga

and here is what is in my plan
http://www.audioaficionado.org/pre-a...tml#post311425

[fred]

Originally Posted by TOGA

epic,

Big problem is that my Ref40 pre amp cannot drive amp that have such a low input impedance. I am very much enjoy sound of Ref40, but it is limit choice of
amplifier too much. Some great amps that incompatible with it due low input impedance are
Burmester 911m3, Gryphon, Soulution, TBC. I will invest heavily on my new disc player soon, so this new amp/preamp project is quite far into the future, and now I think Ref40 and Moon W7M are working together very well.
Toga

and here is what is in my plan
http://www.audioaficionado.org/pre-a...tml#post311425

Hi
The input impédance of the REF 40 is not the same as REF 5 ?

Regards,

[TOGA]

Hi Fred,
I mention that both Ref5 and Ref40 which have "high" output impedance, require to work with powe ramp that has minimum of 20Kohm input impedance. That is some amps
that has very low input impedance, around 4Kohm, 600ohm, like VA, Soulution, Burmester.
Will not work very well with my Ref40.
For your question, I believe 5 and 40 has same input impedance value.

Toga

[Anatta]

Toga, how did you find the Burmester 911 compared to the Evo W7M when both driven by the 077?

[TOGA]

Anatta,
Of course, I tested 911 with 077 only for short time. because I must concentrate
comparing between 111, 089 and Accuphase CD player with my own system.
I use 089>077>911 and 089>077> W7M.. to answer your question. I felt extra refinement from 911 especially in the treble. But 911 was too cold, I didn't give it days of
warm up. I felt extra power and punch from Moon W7M however. I don't feel much improvement from expensive amp that require me to sell Moon. At this top level of equipments I believe all are great in different way. sometimes cost different is from
other reason other than sound quality. some brand spend much $$$ in ads and marketing, and at our cost.
077 sound is very robust and confident sounding. Dynamic and punch is outstanding driving moon. But bringing ARC tube back in and I welcome a more relax
presentation.
due incompatibility, I didn't connect 911 to ARC pre amp. 911 speaker cable tightening nut wings are so large that it prevent me from rotating it freely, the wing make contact with spades.
Jeff from TONE explained this clearly in his magazine. He said 9111MK3 sound better while W7M has limitless performance for 2/3 the price of 911.
Toga

[Anatta]

Thanks Toga!

I agree with you about the (too) subtle improvement very expensive amps bring.

Do you still plan to change the W7M for something else after you're done with your source?

If you keep the ARC pre I'd look at the Ayre MX-Rs since they have a 2MOhm input impedance; from this pov it would be a great match to the ARC pre.

Also you should check the Musical Fidelity Titan (the amp Michael Fremer has), very powerful and has a 200kOhm input impedance.

[TOGA]

Anatta,
There is cool tonality in Moon amp that I wanna changed. So yes, I am still looking for new amp in next year. I like to have a bit warmer tone while " maintain " power/speed of
W7M. I have 4 choice in mind. 1. Constellation Centaur mono 2. Dagostino Momentum
3. Accuphase A200 4. Gryphone Mephisto. New amp budget be around $50,000 MSRP ( actulally price will be lower however) I was almost buy Mark Levinson No.53 when I own
ML 326s pre amp. But since I sold it long ago, I don't need to brand matched any more.
I tried Audio Research Ref 250, I love the sound, but I felt lots of dynamic dropped.
Of all the amps that I tried, I like sound of ARC Ref250 the most.. until concert time that I felt problem. almost
zzz.. due to unexciting dynamic.( compared to W7M)
Surprisingly, By using Burmester as a source,I got warm and liquid voice that I prefer
and that could save me some $$$ from not having to change amp.
For MX-R,I've a friend here once said that he owned it and he replaced it with Momentum and that is much improvement. He is philip psjl. MF Titan ,I really don't
have passion for this brand. Most of MF amps are made in China. I don't want any more
output power from current 500w that I have, I just want warmer, more liquid sounding and more refinement as a bonus( not that moon is unrefined).
By changing from Burmester 111 to CD players, $$$ prepared for new amp are much
gone.. so new amp will be farther away. may be late 2013 or 2014.
Toga

[Anatta]

The Mephisto Stereo is 50k Euro in Europe and has a quoted input impedance of 20kOhm, the minimum required by ARC as you know. Can you get it for under 50k $US?

I couldn't find the input impedance of the Momentums.

The Accuphase is certainly warmer than Moon but I don't think it has the same speed/slam, it's a more relaxed presentation.

I suggested the MX-R because of the very high input impedance, but if you're looking for added warmth I don't know if it will satisfy you. Giving it a try won't hurt I guess.

The MF Titan is warmer than the Moon; this particular model is made in the UK; as far as I know just the lower end stuff is made in Taiwan.

I find that the Moon line from Simaudio is warmer than the Evo line. You should try the 400M monos as a cheap alternative, I think they're a bargain at their price. There's a pretty accurate review of them on Soundstage.

Simaudio Moon 400M Mono Amplifiers