Which SS amp, for this C-J noob?

[bgiliberti]

Originally Posted by CDLehner

Thanks again; I'd love to go up the C-J ladder, but the timing couldn't be more awful to think about extending myself.

I appreciate all the advice guys; trust me, that Premier 350 sounds like an amp to end all amps, and it'll be on my wish-list...down the road. But for now, better focus on these MFs, which seem to be available more in my budget.

So the 2300 and 2500 are newer than the 2250? I thought the 2300 was the oldest of the bunch, and the 2250 and 2500 were from the same series? If the 2300 and 2500 are from the same era, what's the big difference; I know the power seems to be rated the same?

Checkout the CJ website. They have all the vintage products listed in great detail. Kind of fun to browse through, too. One difference that might matter is when they switched to bi-polar output transistors. I think the 2500 is that, and the 2250 may also be. It should be explained on the website. I prefer pure mosfet for the smoothness, but others will have different view -- its still CJ, so it will be great!!!

[CDLehner]

OK...let me switch the direction a little bit, and ask this: I saw a 2300a, good price...but the faceplate wasn't in such great shape and that put me off it a bit.

I know, I know...the faceplate doesn't have anything to do with the sound...lol; but we all want pride in ownership, right? How hard are faceplates to come by..and what do they tend to run?

[CDLehner]

Originally Posted by bgiliberti

Checkout the CJ website. They have all the vintage products listed in great detail. Kind of fun to browse through, too. One difference that might matter is when they switched to bi-polar output transistors. I think the 2500 is that, and the 2250 may also be. It should be explained on the website. I prefer pure mosfet for the smoothness, but others will have different view -- its still CJ, so it will be great!!!

Is that anything like LMGTFY; or RTFM?

J/K; I certainly don't mind doing my own homework. OK, straight from the mother-site: 2300 released in '93, a-revision done in '95. 2250 and 2500 released in '98; a-revision presumably done around '00.

So the 2300(a) is the oldest of my 3 contenders, but it has the same power rating as the 2500(a); it's just a matter of do I prefer MOSFETs or the bi-polar transistors. Well...someone want to tell me which I prefer...lol

And if I'm not mistaken, the 2250a has an IEC socket? Is it possible they only did this with the 2250a, and not also the 2500a from the same series?

[Puma Cat]

Hi CD,
Glad to see you made it over here.

Told ya this was the best C-J forum around!

Cheers,
PC

[Puma Cat]

CD,
I know the CA-200 is out of your budget for an amp; but Ron's suggestion really is the best one for your needs. If you were able to sell your other preamps, including the Belles, the McCormack, and the 150A, the questions is would that allow you to buy a CA200?

An example: if you've spent $2700 for a NAD M3 to try out, you could have put that money plus selling the other components towards a CA-200 and be under budget.

-PC

[bgiliberti]

Originally Posted by CDLehner

...it's just a matter of do I prefer MOSFETs or the bi-polar transistors. Well...someone want to tell me which I prefer...lol ....

I prefer MOSFETS, but I don't get a vote on CJ election day. That privilege is reserved to Messrs C & J, who say the current design is better. If they were stupid, they wouldn't still be in business all these years, so I would go with them I may just like the slightly creamier sound of all MOSFET designs. Others mileage may vary....

[Rayooo]

Originally Posted by bgiliberti

I prefer MOSFETS, but I don't get a vote on CJ election day. That privilege is reserved to Messrs C & J, who say the current design is better. If they were stupid, they wouldn't still be in business all these years, so I would go with them I may just like the slightly creamier sound of all MOSFET designs. Others mileage may vary....

It seems there have been a few "generations" w/regards to mosfet/bipolar. back around the time I owned a NYAL Moscode, it seemed Mosfet outputs were the thing, bipolar were just plain terrible. It seems somewhere along the line things have changed, now seems bipolar is more prevalent for SS output devices, FETS at input.

One argument for Mosfets back when was the thermal issues with bipolar, but here we are now back to bipolar. I was a collector of the old Marantz 22XX receiver series, originally reported to sound like crap due to the bipolar outputs, now 30 years later, everyone wants a 2270 with the original old Motorola bipolar outputs. what a fun hobby.

[CDLehner]

Guys, good advice...one and all. I've learned plenty; like...I need a raise, and where to set my sights once I get one.

PC, I hear what you're suggesting about the CA200; if I were to just stop f***ing around with all my other crap, and sell-off the McCormack RLD-1, Belles 21a, Belles 150a half-a-Hot-Rod...and this newly acquired M3 (which I didn't pay anywhere near $2700 for...just for the record); I could likely swing a CA200.

I've read the excellent press...including the Tone Audio review, where the guy calls it just short of a Premier 18LS, and baby Premier 350 rolled into one. High praise indeed, and food for thought. The problem is...I like all that other crap too...lol; and as I'm just wading into C-J, it's hard to essentially say "let me give up the system I've built to this point...in its entirety...and just replace it with this single box from C-J".

Sure, if the end result is it would sound better, then I guess that's the end-goal; but it's a tough call to make for now. I'd have to bite off the ~$3500 first...and then figure it out. Like I said...food for thought. In the meantime, sounds like a 2250a might make a really nice...inexpensive...mate to my Belles pre, and that would allow me to wade-in to the C-J world.

What...didn't you tell these guys what a hand-wringer I am?

[Puma Cat]

Originally Posted by CDLehner

Guys, good advice...one and all. I've learned plenty; like...I need a raise, and where to set my sights once I get one.

PC, I hear what you're suggesting about the CA200; if I were to just stop f***ing around with all my other crap, and sell-off the McCormack RLD-1, Belles 21a, Belles 150a half-a-Hot-Rod...and this newly acquired M3 (which I didn't pay anywhere near $2700 for...just for the record); I could likely swing a CA200.

Yes. BTW, would you be using the M3 as an integrated? How would this be different than a CA200 in this respect?

PC

[bgiliberti]

Originally Posted by Rayooo

It seems there have been a few "generations" w/regards to mosfet/bipolar. back around the time I owned a NYAL Moscode, it seemed Mosfet outputs were the thing, bipolar were just plain terrible. It seems somewhere along the line things have changed, now seems bipolar is more prevalent for SS output devices, FETS at input.

One argument for Mosfets back when was the thermal issues with bipolar, but here we are now back to bipolar. I was a collector of the old Marantz 22XX receiver series, originally reported to sound like crap due to the bipolar outputs, now 30 years later, everyone wants a 2270 with the original old Motorola bipolar outputs. what a fun hobby.

I owned one of the original Sony VFETS, then a Hafler DH 100 MOSFET, and then the MF80 MOSFET. The argument for all of those devices as best I can recall was "soft clipping" (MOSFET; vacuum tubes) vs. hard clipping (Bi-polar.) Perhaps that issue has been resolved on bi-polar (like build them with 100 times more power than you need so they never get close to clipping.). Actually, I think thermal problems were what eventually sunk VFETS (which were quite sweet). As far as MOSFETs, all I can say is that my trusty old MF80 barely gets warm to the touch, and has only 80 watts.