AudioAficionado.org  

Go Back   AudioAficionado.org > Manufacturers Forums > Conrad-Johnson

Conrad-Johnson It just sounds right

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #181  
Old 09-30-2016, 01:47 AM
bgiliberti bgiliberti is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 140
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by plurn View Post
From your earlier post, was there any reason you chose to raise this question quoting my post specifically, as opposed to any of the other posts from other people talking about old tubes? From your earlier post it kind of sounded like you found something about the situation I presented that made you think "aha - those might be counterfeit". If that is the case, what was it about my situation that made you think that at the time? I expect I have since allayed your fears about this for my purchases, since I provided more information on the integrity of the supplier in my last post.

Or do you think all claimed "new old stock" tubes from all suppliers are counterfeit (or used)? From your last post, it is not clear but it kind of sounds like that is what you might be getting at when you say "the term NOS at this point strikes me as total joke. Like Phillips and Telefunken did not see the transistor age coming, and kept producing warehouses full of old tubes that audiophiles are now paying a fortune for? Give me a break."

Anthony
Although I responded to your post, I was speaking generally. Also, if you paid a fair price, and the tubes sound great, who cares? I certainly don't think "all" of the NOS tubes are counterfeits or knock-offs, 95% would be more like it. However, if someone who retired from Phillips or Telefunken in 1964 posted that his retirement party was held in a warehouse filled with millions of obsolete tubes, I would lower my estimate to 80%. Have at me NOS valve distributors...
Reply With Quote
  #182  
Old 09-30-2016, 03:06 AM
plurn plurn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 36
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bgiliberti View Post
Although I responded to your post, I was speaking generally. Also, if you paid a fair price, and the tubes sound great, who cares? I certainly don't think "all" of the NOS tubes are counterfeits or knock-offs, 95% would be more like it. However, if someone who retired from Phillips or Telefunken in 1964 posted that his retirement party was held in a warehouse filled with millions of obsolete tubes, I would lower my estimate to 80%. Have at me NOS valve distributors...
Thanks for clarifying your point of view.

Anthony
Reply With Quote
  #183  
Old 09-30-2016, 07:09 AM
turntable's Avatar
turntable turntable is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Downunder in Sydney
Posts: 1,774
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bILLwOJO View Post
Wow, those things really eat tubes. They should have had a way to lower the filament voltage down to 6.1V or so. The old Dynaco preamps came with Telefunken tubes from the factory. Yea, I know, not in the same league as A CJ preamp but they ran the filaments a little low and most of these can be found with the original tube compliment still in them. Heck, when I found my crusty MC40 monoblocks they still had most of the original tubes.
CJ should come up with a solution and fix all of these at no charge. A lot of coin for a flawed design.

BillWojo
Certainly not a flawed design. One of the best sounding preamps ever made and still is.
The trouble is current 6922 production is shite unfortunately.

I have had my Telefunken tubes for over two years and no further problems and it sounds like a dream.
Reply With Quote
  #184  
Old 10-08-2016, 09:29 PM
microstrip microstrip is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 395
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by plurn View Post
Further to my earlier post http://www.audioaficionado.org/conra...tml#post802534 I decided to stock up on the Philips PCC88 tubes while they are still relatively cheap at the place I buy them. These should last me a while:



For my current usage of about 2700 hours per year, I estimate these 30 tubes will last at least 16 years in my ET5. Could end up less than that or a lot more then that depending on various factors. Hopefully most of them are as good as the four that I originally purchased.

Does anyone know if these are the same as the one CJ supplies for the GAT? They have factory code DJER.

What follows is probably of no interest to anyone but you never know.

Researching these tubes I have the following information:

- from the factory code DJER, DJ = PCC88. Don't know what ER stands for.
- They are not from CJ or from Upscale Audio. Upscale says the following about their Philips PCC88 which looks the same "This tube has Philips Holland parts, and the associated sound. They were assembled in the Ei factory according to the small etched codes on the glass.". They don't say what the code is.
- Another site worthpoint had very similar looking Philips PCC88 for sale in the past and their ones had factory code "DJER @ 4I". Their description said "Philips PCC88 Produced in Sept. 1964 for Philips by EI (Electronska Industria, Jugoslavia)". My ones just have factory code DJER rather than "DJER @ 4I". Perhaps from the "4I", the 4 indicates 1964, and the "i" indicates september? If that is the case then I suspect something in the "ER" from DJER indicates that they were produced by EI.

So I don't know if that means mine were made by EI or somewhere else. I suspect they were made at EI with Philips Holland parts since all the others seem to be. If they were made in Holland I would think they would say "Made in Holland". That is just a guess.

Anthony
I also bought a large stock of the same type PCC88 Philips with codes DJER 4F and 4G. I have measured about 10 and they are in general low noise and both triodes are matched in gain and DC - an important parameter as the sections work in parallel in my LP275s. From these 10 only one had one noisy triode in the low frequencies - it is now burning-in for a few days, as I have found that some tubes that are initially noisy become silent after 50-100 hours burn-in.

Measuring a few used noisy ECC88/6922 I have found that their triodes were significantly unbalanced. Probably tubes in these conditions will ear out much faster as the tube current does not split equally between the triodes.
Reply With Quote
  #185  
Old 10-09-2016, 11:36 AM
plurn plurn is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 36
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by microstrip View Post
I also bought a large stock of the same type PCC88 Philips with codes DJER 4F and 4G. I have measured about 10 and they are in general low noise and both triodes are matched in gain and DC - an important parameter as the sections work in parallel in my LP275s. From these 10 only one had one noisy triode in the low frequencies - it is now burning-in for a few days, as I have found that some tubes that are initially noisy become silent after 50-100 hours burn-in.

Measuring a few used noisy ECC88/6922 I have found that their triodes were significantly unbalanced. Probably tubes in these conditions will ear out much faster as the tube current does not split equally between the triodes.
That is good that they have acceptable measurements and that a good proportion of them are usable. Thanks for reporting the codes. I would think 4F = 1964 June, and 4G = 1964 July.

You have inspired me to check the codes on my tubes more closely. I have found that on some of them, the second row of codes is just barely visible and almost readable with a magnifying glass and a flashlight.



Under the DJER row, mine seem to have a row with three characters starting with a partial circle character, followed by 4H. I think the partial circle character must be this one for "Elektronski Industija, Nis, Yugoslavia":



I would think the 4H would be 1964 August.

Anthony

Last edited by plurn; 06-08-2018 at 04:25 PM. Reason: updated image url
Reply With Quote
  #186  
Old 01-31-2022, 02:34 PM
keef keef is offline
Senior Member

 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: East Coast
Posts: 325
Default

Rekindling an old thread about ET5 and other CJ preamps. Just ordered another Philips PCC88 from CJ after my Seimans ECC88 6DJ8 became noisey/crackly.

The Seimans actually made it about 2 1/2 years or close to 900 hours or so I estimate. Good sounding and tough tube, sonically more of a front row perspective with a nice top end and great clarity without sounding harsh.

I think the Philips is more balanced top to bottom. Maybe a bit warmer than both the Seimans and EH. The EH doesn’t last any time in my ET5 and it is a shame because I like it better than the Philips.

I noticed CJ now offers the Philips, EH, and Gold Lion now. Anyone had any luck with a hopefully newer batch of EH?
__________________
Main System
Basis 2200 Signature/Vector 4/Transfiguration Proteus
Ortofon Cadenza Black
Allnic H3000/CJ ET5/Mcintosh 501's
Thiel CS3.6
Thiel CS6
MIT EVO 2 IC
Straightwire Maestro II SC
Shunyata Denali SV2
Shunyata Sigma XC
Wywires Juice PC’s
Kubala Sosna PC’s
Dedicated 20 amp lines
Porter Ports
Arcici Ref Suspense Stand
Rives acoustically designed room

Shore House
Basis 1400 Signature/Hadcock 228/Ortofon Jubilee
ARC PH 5/Meridian 200/Meridian 263 DAC
CJ Premier 14/Classe CA200/Thiel 3.6
Wywires Silver IC/Stereolab Diablo SC/MIT Z cord II
Reply With Quote
  #187  
Old 01-31-2022, 06:43 PM
Puma Cat's Avatar
Puma Cat Puma Cat is offline
Cool, calm scientist

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 10,915
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by keef View Post
Rekindling an old thread about ET5 and other CJ preamps. Just ordered another Philips PCC88 from CJ after my Seimans ECC88 6DJ8 became noisey/crackly.

The Seimans actually made it about 2 1/2 years or close to 900 hours or so I estimate. Good sounding and tough tube, sonically more of a front row perspective with a nice top end and great clarity without sounding harsh.

I think the Philips is more balanced top to bottom. Maybe a bit warmer than both the Seimans and EH. The EH doesn’t last any time in my ET5 and it is a shame because I like it better than the Philips.

I noticed CJ now offers the Philips, EH, and Gold Lion now. Anyone had any luck with a hopefully newer batch of EH?
Nope. I never liked the EH tubes very much. They always sound somewhat clinical and sterile to me in my LP70S. I much preferred the Ediswan 6922s, but you can't get those anymore, so I'm using Gold Lion, which I also like. My CT-5 required 6N30Ps, and IIiRC, only Sovtek makes those, so I was stuck with that specific tube. I used a mil-spec 6N30P-DR, which was a more durable tube than standard specification.
__________________
Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
Reply With Quote
  #188  
Old 02-01-2022, 08:44 AM
keef keef is offline
Senior Member

 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: East Coast
Posts: 325
Default

Thanks Puma Cat, I may try Gold Lions in the future. Curious to see how long the Philips last this time around. I also have another 1960’s NOS Seimans ECC88 on the way.
__________________
Main System
Basis 2200 Signature/Vector 4/Transfiguration Proteus
Ortofon Cadenza Black
Allnic H3000/CJ ET5/Mcintosh 501's
Thiel CS3.6
Thiel CS6
MIT EVO 2 IC
Straightwire Maestro II SC
Shunyata Denali SV2
Shunyata Sigma XC
Wywires Juice PC’s
Kubala Sosna PC’s
Dedicated 20 amp lines
Porter Ports
Arcici Ref Suspense Stand
Rives acoustically designed room

Shore House
Basis 1400 Signature/Hadcock 228/Ortofon Jubilee
ARC PH 5/Meridian 200/Meridian 263 DAC
CJ Premier 14/Classe CA200/Thiel 3.6
Wywires Silver IC/Stereolab Diablo SC/MIT Z cord II
Reply With Quote
  #189  
Old 02-02-2022, 05:27 PM
Puma Cat's Avatar
Puma Cat Puma Cat is offline
Cool, calm scientist

 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: East Bay, CA
Posts: 10,915
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by keef View Post
Thanks Puma Cat, I may try Gold Lions in the future. Curious to see how long the Philips last this time around. I also have another 1960’s NOS Seimans ECC88 on the way.
FWIW, I had one of the Philips ECC88s let go on me on the C-J ART150 I had in for review. There was "Pop!" out of the left channel, and then a continual buzz. Jeff sent me some Slovakian tubes to use for the remainder of the review period.

FWIW, I've never had any issues with tubes, either input stage tubes, nor output stage tubes on my LP70S.

Though I've been exclusively using a Constellation Inspiration integrated () since the ART amp went back to C-J, so tubes aren't an issue of any kind at the moment.
__________________
Lumin P1 streamer/DAC/preamp, Constellation Inspiration integrated TT: Michell Gyro SE MkII, SME V, Koetsu Urushi Vermilion, EAR324. Harbeth 30.2s, REL R-305, Shunyata Alpha V2 ICs, Alpha V2 SPs, Sigma XC, Sigma NRv2, Omega QR-s & Alpha NRv2 PCs, segmented Altaira SG stack w/ Alpha & Omega CGCs, Everest 8000 PD. Remote Server Room: Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark Master Clock & LPS, Alita, Battle Angel, (Akasa NUC Roon Core), iFi DC Purifiers (for SMPS used for Alita & router), Shunyata Gemini combo power distributor & Altaira-type CG GP-NR hub, Venom & Alpha CGCs, Shunyata NRv14 power cords for digital components.
Reply With Quote
  #190  
Old 02-16-2022, 12:27 AM
Oddiofyl Oddiofyl is offline
Guest
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 4
Default

I had really good luck with two tubes in my Classic 2SE.... genuine NOS 6h23neb Volkshod Rocket and Gold Lion 6922. Both lasted long and sounded great. JJ 6922 are good if you can get one that is quiet.

I recently pulled the CJ out of service. I'm on the fence about keeping it or my Sonic Frontiers SFL-1 as a back up..

I used some 60's Mazda 6922 for a short time , sounded best but those tubes didn't last very long. The CJs are tough on tubes , but they sound great ......
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Audioaficionado.org tested by Norton Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:32 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
©Copyright 2009-2023 AudioAficionado.org.Privately owned, All Rights Reserved.
Audio Aficionado Sponsors
AudioAficionado Subscriber
AudioAficionado Subscriber
Inspire By Dennis Had
Inspire By Dennis Had
Harmonic Resolution Systems
Harmonic Resolution Systems
Wyred4Sound
Wyred4Sound
Dragonfire Acoustics
Dragonfire Acoustics
GIK Acoustics
GIK Acoustics
Esoteric
Esoteric
AC Infinity
AC Infinity
JL Audio
JL Audio
Add Powr
Add Powr
Accuphase - Soulution
Accuphase - Soulution
Audio by E
Audio by E
Canton
Canton
Bryston
Bryston
WireWorld Cables
WireWorld Cables
Stillpoints
Stillpoints
Bricasti Design
Bricasti Design
Furutech
Furutech
Shunyata Research
Shunyata Research
Legend Audio & Video
Legend Audio & Video