Esoteric P-02/D-02

[Colekat]

Originally Posted by PlanarSpeakerFan

Thanks Ken,

I'll be getting my K-01 before too long and this info is a big help.

Ken

Ken isn't it great, your gonna love the K-01!

[PlanarSpeakerFan]

Originally Posted by Colekat

Ken isn't it great, your gonna love the K-01!

I'm really looking forward to it, Tom. I'm expecting a huge improvement even right out of the box. My amps and speakers should shine with a source component of this quality.

P.S. - It won't be long now, Ivan.

Ken

[Car commander]

It will sound good out of the box but much better at about 300 hours. Mine has continued to improve and has about 800 hours on it. I used the break in disc and put about 200 hours on it before I listened to it.

[eelii08]

Originally Posted by Colekat

Eelii, Absolutely, This is the e-mail I got from Tim Crable
Hello, Tom.
*
*** You should connect the P-02*to the D-02 using two AES/EBU cables..* Do NOT use the firewire.... it's there to allow you to talk to a DAC that is not ESOTERIC but sounds really bad.
*
The cables need to be the same length and if you stack the units, 1 meter is plenty long.* If they end up some distance apart, then go to 1.5 meters.
*
** Set the P-02*to "XLR = "Dual".* Turn off both*the RCA and the I-Link outputs.* Set the "DAC" type in the settings to ESL3.
*
** The D-02 input should be set to "DUAL" using the front panel button.* Most owner's play with the upsampling and digital filter settings.* The most popular filter is "S-Dly2" and upsampling to 176.4 kHz.* These settings should be tried to see what works best with your system.
*
** Connect a 75 ohm BNC to BNC cable to the word out on the D-02 and to the Word in connector on the P-02.** On the D-02 turn word clock to "W-OUT"* Set "WOUT" frequency to 176.4KHz.
*
** On the P-02, turn the Word clock to "ON".* It is imperative that the word clock be synchronized between the D-02 and the P-02.* Once you get the G-01, you would connect both the D-02 and the P-02 to the output of the G-01.* An audible but very slight improvement is made when you use the G-01 with the P-02/D-02.
*

Best regards, Tim

Thanks Tom,

I don't Know Tim. I think I recall he help me with a mail in the past giving me support with an old unit, although I am not US based, but in any case reading his advices I do like him and his replies. He seems to be responsive. And is very candid in his replies.

I say this because of his comments about the expected improvement on the G-01 with the 02s. You would expect the typical answer about huge improvements and how it takes the 02s to a different level and blah, blah, blah... In stead he defines the effect as an audible but very slight improvement. That is not what I have experienced but it is very honest of him.

That is precisely how I would have defined the effect of the clock with my old 03s digitals. AS you know I had the clock at home for trial twice with my old 03s, and the improvement was that: very slight at best. SO much so that both times I decided to pass on the clock, and I really wanted to hear an improvement to buy it.. but I did not. However with the 02s it was a totally different history. In 5 minutes I noticed a large improvement and that is how much it took me to make up my mind (and that was with the old G-0rb model; the improvement with the G-0 was even greater).

Why that was the case I really don't know since at the time some people reported also large improvements with the 03s and clock, while others did not. It may have to do with the higher resolving capabilities of the 02s, or a better implementation. Or it may be system specific. This last I think may be the case. My system is much more resolving and capable now that it was when I tried the clock with the 03s, specially at the speakers level, and that may explain. I tend to think that the more resolving and capable your system is the greater you can hear the effect of the clock in the system. But the truth is that the improvements I hear with the clock on the system are very material in all areas of reproduction. Staging, location plus 3d of the presentation is just far superior, but improvements are all over.

We will see Tom what you hear, but reading about your system I think you will be closer to my findings.

[eelii08]

[QUOTE=Colekat;549050]

** Set the P-02*to "XLR = "Dual".* Turn off both*the RCA and the I-Link outputs.* Set the "DAC" type in the settings to ESL3.
*
** The D-02 input should be set to "DUAL" using the front panel button.* Most owner's play with the upsampling and digital filter settings.* The most popular filter is "S-Dly2" and upsampling to 176.4 kHz.* These settings should be tried to see what works best with your system.
*


Also, reading his reply about how to set up things and going again through the manuals,

On the set up of the P02, he says to set it at ESL3, which is clearly the case when you use a D02 with it. But says nothing about the Upconvert option (which is the first in the menu). The manual of the P02 says you can leave this to ORG and no up conversion is used and output done to the D02 at 44.1KHz. Or to set it to 2Fs, 4Fs, or 8Fs for 88.2KHz, 176,4KHz or 352.8KHz. output.

It later says that if you set DAC to ESL3, if up converting is set at ORG, 2F or 4F, the PCM signal will be output at 48-bit, and if 8Fs it will be output at 24-bit.

Taking into account that the D02 has the same Upconvert menu, I do wonder which would be the ideal set up. Do the up convert at the transport and leaving the DAC at ORG (which according to manual of D02 "the input signal is sent straight to the D/A converter at the original sampling frequency") or leaving transport at ORG and doing it at the DAC. Or setting both at the same value.

Frankly I have not experienced with the alternatives and not even sure it makes any difference, but is something that I have always wondered as the manuals do not say. It does not make sense at least in theory to pass the signal twice through up conversion. Leaving one in original and the other to up convert makes more sense. But who knows and if so which one is better to do the job is also unclear.

With the 03s it was clear since it was only the transport the one that had the capability of up converting PCM and not the DAC. With the 02s acting as a system there is basically 3 possibilities. Wonder which is better for any given desired up convert value (if any).

[Colekat]

[quote=eelii08;549506]

Originally Posted by Colekat

** Set the P-02*to "XLR = "Dual".* Turn off both*the RCA and the I-Link outputs.* Set the "DAC" type in the settings to ESL3.
*
** The D-02 input should be set to "DUAL" using the front panel button.* Most owner's play with the upsampling and digital filter settings.* The most popular filter is "S-Dly2" and upsampling to 176.4 kHz.* These settings should be tried to see what works best with your system.
*


Also, reading his reply about how to set up things and going again through the manuals,

On the set up of the P02, he says to set it at ESL3, which is clearly the case when you use a D02 with it. But says nothing about the Upconvert option (which is the first in the menu). The manual of the P02 says you can leave this to ORG and no up conversion is used and output done to the D02 at 44.1KHz. Or to set it to 2Fs, 4Fs, or 8Fs for 88.2KHz, 176,4KHz or 352.8KHz. output.

It later says that if you set DAC to ESL3, if up converting is set at ORG, 2F or 4F, the PCM signal will be output at 48-bit, and if 8Fs it will be output at 24-bit.

Taking into account that the D02 has the same Upconvert menu, I do wonder which would be the ideal set up. Do the up convert at the transport and leaving the DAC at ORG (which according to manual of D02 "the input signal is sent straight to the D/A converter at the original sampling frequency") or leaving transport at ORG and doing it at the DAC. Or setting both at the same value.

Frankly I have not experienced with the alternatives and not even sure it makes any difference, but is something that I have always wondered as the manuals do not say. It does not make sense at least in theory to pass the signal twice through up conversion. Leaving one in original and the other to up convert makes more sense. But who knows and if so which one is better to do the job is also unclear.

With the 03s it was clear since it was only the transport the one that had the capability of up converting PCM and not the DAC. With the 02s acting as a system there is basically 3 possibilities. Wonder which is better for any given desired up convert value (if any).

Eelii, The manuals do not do a good job of explaining the set-up options and the effects they may have. I think at this level there is an assumption we are all geniuses and we know what we are doing, not taking into account the speed at which things change in the architecture of these digital components. As soon as you get used too the options of your current gear, which can take years of fiddling around, we are introducing something new to the mix or an upgrade
and need to understand how we are effecting the whole. Thats why I am greatful there is this forum and others to gather insights into what can be done. You have been a great help in my implimentation of set up and gave me confidence to buy the clock! And everyone else who contributes to this thread is really helpful, as this is big bucks for me and I don't want to be using it without maximum results!

[eelii08]

So what's up Tom. Did you connect the clock already? Any feedback?

[Colekat]

Originally Posted by eelii08

So what's up Tom. Did you connect the clock already? Any feedback?

HaHa, The clock will make its appearance this weekend. My wife is very close to delivering our latest little audiophile, Luca Tomasso, he just might beat the clock if I don't hurry up! I've been distracted with preparing for the new baby.
Ah, what a month, a new clock... And a new baby.

I'll keep you posted !

[PlanarSpeakerFan]

Originally Posted by Colekat

HaHa, The clock will make its appearance this weekend. My wife is very close to delivering our latest little audiophile, Luca Tomasso, he just might beat the clock if I don't hurry up! I've been distracted with preparing for the new baby.
Ah, what a month, a new clock... And a new baby.

I'll keep you posted !

Best wishes, Tom. Lot's of excitement in the Colekat household! We'll want a full report once she's set up...the clock that is

Ken

[bart]

Originally Posted by PlanarSpeakerFan

Best wishes, Tom. Lot's of excitement in the Colekat household! We'll want a full report once she's set up...the clock that is

Ken

And the baby too of course!

Good luck Tom!