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Turntables & Tonearms Where Analog still Rules

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  #41  
Old 07-31-2016, 05:02 PM
shaizada shaizada is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlexibleAudio View Post
Thank you very much. I think I am going to do it.
@FlexibleAudio, can you tell me more about the difference between the Ascona MKI and MKII versions?

I am considering the purchase of the Ascona MKI or the Kuzma XL4 turntable with the Airline Tonearm.

Thanks!!

PS:- Are you located in Southern California by any chance?
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Analog: Ear Discmaster, Redpoint Model D, VPI TNT 6 Hot Rod, Townshend Rock 7, EAR 324, VDH Grasshopper III GLA, Dynavector XV-1T, Dynavector XV-1S, Jorma Prime/Origo, Jan Allaerts, Einstein Turntables Choice, Digital: EAR Acute IV / Dac IV Preamp: EAR 912, Ray Samuels B-52 Amplifiers: EAR 890 Monoblocks, Concert Fidelity ZL-120V2SE, Almarro 318B Accessories: Stillpoints ESS Rack, Sistrum, KS Emotion Cables Speakers: Marten Coltrane Tenor
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  #42  
Old 07-31-2016, 09:27 PM
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FlexibleAudio FlexibleAudio is offline
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The Ascona was changed for 2 reasons. First, a much smaller foot print makes it more rack friendly. Second, and this was the main reason - the improvement with the sub-platter driven by 3 motors direct. This was first used at the Novum. There was so much positive feedback on the sound and the look that they felt right in developing it for the Ascona. It added a lot of rhythm and energy to the sound. With the development of the Invictus they did the new sandwich platter which is also available as a upgrade to the Ascona Mk2 (I have this option). The platter takes the Ascona Mk2 closer to the Invictus from a noise floor and resolution standpoint due to its exceptional damping. So with the Mk2 they took away the flywheel drive and added a 3 motor direct drive to a sub-platter. And the option to have the sandwich platter.

The mechanical construction otherwise stayed the same.
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Last edited by FlexibleAudio; 07-31-2016 at 09:34 PM.
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  #43  
Old 08-01-2016, 06:00 AM
shaizada shaizada is offline
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Paul,

Thank you for that useful piece of information. Now, I spoke with Gunther and am looking towards doing the MKI with the new motor controller updates. The MKII is a better table, but I just bought a very special suspension based turntable (EAR Discmaster) and am looking to complement it with a Mass Loaded design type table. I think the MKI should suffice.

Have you had a chance to compare between the two types? I'm curious how much different they are sonically. If the MKII is at 100%, where would the MKI be sonically?

Again, thanks for the info!
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Analog: Ear Discmaster, Redpoint Model D, VPI TNT 6 Hot Rod, Townshend Rock 7, EAR 324, VDH Grasshopper III GLA, Dynavector XV-1T, Dynavector XV-1S, Jorma Prime/Origo, Jan Allaerts, Einstein Turntables Choice, Digital: EAR Acute IV / Dac IV Preamp: EAR 912, Ray Samuels B-52 Amplifiers: EAR 890 Monoblocks, Concert Fidelity ZL-120V2SE, Almarro 318B Accessories: Stillpoints ESS Rack, Sistrum, KS Emotion Cables Speakers: Marten Coltrane Tenor
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  #44  
Old 07-21-2017, 11:13 PM
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mtroo mtroo is offline
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I have read the review by Roy Gregory which was quite positive. Any real world experience with this tone arm?
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Amplifiers: McIntosh 1.2 Kw
Preamp: Esoteric C03
Speakers: Salon2 with F113v2 x 2
Analog: VPI Avenger Reference with Ortofon A95 and Esoteric E03 phonostage
Digital: Silenzio and Esoteric K03-x and G02
Power Management: PS Audio P10 x 2, P5
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  #45  
Old 07-23-2017, 01:16 AM
tima tima is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtroo View Post
I have read the review by Roy Gregory which was quite positive. Any real world experience with this tone arm?
There is a thread started by a purchaser of the 14" 4Point on an analog oriented forum along with several pictures. I'll try to send the address to you. In the meantime here is a quote from the owner: "I suggest you read Roy Gregory’s review in the March issue of Hi-FI+. He’s much better “sound describer” than I am (English is not my native language) and I agree basicly with everything he wrote."

Fwiw Roy has the 14" arm as part of his system - he has real world experience. You can easily send him an e-mail with questions. Odds are he'll respond.

Operationally the 14" 4P works like the 11" version assuming your table can accomodate it. You may need a longer measuring device for pivot-to-spindle. I have an original Feickert and confirm it will work with that.
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  #46  
Old 07-26-2017, 12:45 AM
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mtroo mtroo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tima View Post
There is a thread started by a purchaser of the 14" 4Point on an analog oriented forum along with several pictures. I'll try to send the address to you. In the meantime here is a quote from the owner: "I suggest you read Roy Gregory’s review in the March issue of Hi-FI+. He’s much better “sound describer” than I am (English is not my native language) and I agree basicly with everything he wrote."

Fwiw Roy has the 14" arm as part of his system - he has real world experience. You can easily send him an e-mail with questions. Odds are he'll respond.

Operationally the 14" 4P works like the 11" version assuming your table can accomodate it. You may need a longer measuring device for pivot-to-spindle. I have an original Feickert and confirm it will work with that.
As always, thanks for your response.
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Tim
Amplifiers: McIntosh 1.2 Kw
Preamp: Esoteric C03
Speakers: Salon2 with F113v2 x 2
Analog: VPI Avenger Reference with Ortofon A95 and Esoteric E03 phonostage
Digital: Silenzio and Esoteric K03-x and G02
Power Management: PS Audio P10 x 2, P5
Cables: WW PE7 SC & IC, Furutech Flux-50 Filters
Rack: HRS SXR Signature
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  #47  
Old 09-21-2021, 05:58 AM
Balazs Balazs is offline
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Any owner of the long 4Point here? Any long time results with this nice tonearm?
Do Someone use the 14” with Lyra Atlas (the first edition) or DS-Audio W2 cartridges?
Any other cartridge recommendations?

Thanks for any input!
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  #48  
Old 09-22-2021, 05:42 AM
tima tima is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balazs View Post
Any owner of the long 4Point here? Any long time results with this nice tonearm?
Do Someone use the 14” with Lyra Atlas (the first edition) or DS-Audio W2 cartridges?
Any other cartridge recommendations?

Thanks for any input!
With the 14" 4Point you want to keep in mind its effective mass, which is 19 grams, and match that with the compliance of your cartridge. Both 11" and 14" 4Points like relatively low compliance cartridges. The reason for matching cartridge with arm using these parameters is to avoid cart-arm resonance outside a range of roughly 7-12Hz.

There is a calculator on the Vinyl Engine site that will show you the safe and unsafe frequency ranges for a given compliance, cartridge weight and effective mass. Here

Just look up the specs for the cartridge you want to evaluate.

The compliance number is a bit of an odd duck in that there are two ways to measure it. The calculator is designed for cartridges that use a measurement frequency of 10Hz. Many Japanese made cartridges are measured at 100Hz. There is no conversion. What I do sometimes is take the compliance number of a cart measured at 100Hz and multiply that by 1.5. None of this is a hard and fast rule, but it should give you some idea of compatibility.

The original Lyra Atlas has a compliance of 12 and 9.2g weight. Add in 1-2 grams for mounting screws. It should be fine with the 14" 4Point.

Another low compliance cartridge that works well with the 4Points is the Fuuga.
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