803 Diamond vs 804 Diamond - Wow!

[dantes0929]

Originally Posted by OldTex

I feel like a doofus.

I've been having a hard time choosing speakers for a new Mac system. I've been out of high end for a while and am kind of out of touch so I've driven all over Dallas-Ft Worth lately to audition Martin Logan, B&W, Vienna Acoustics, Sonus Faber, and others.

Up until today the B&W 804 Diamonds were leading the pack in my targeted price range but still had a big question mark because of another speaker I have never had a chance to audition - the Tannoy Kensington SE. Even though they were untested, the Tannoys' reviews make them sound like exactly what I wanted. And I had lingering doubts about the 804s even though they had beat out the others I had tried. I'm not sure what words to use but they just sounded brassy at times, or thin or tinny in the upper mid-range with certain music. "Bright" is the word I've often heard but that's not at all what I mean.

I had never listened to the upper end of the B&W Diamond series because I was already at the upper end of my budget. (Who am I kidding? I've already blown my original budget out of the water by over 200%.) Besides, my local shop keeps the top-end stuff in another room and I had never ventured in there. Why taunt temptation?

Today I took my new bride on a listening tour for the first time. She's never experienced true high end sound before and my current mid-fi system is likely the best she's ever spent any time with. We listened to the 804s and a few others and then for whatever reason we went into the high-dollar room and slipped in a couple of my favorite quality recordings. She liked the big Martin Logans till she heard the price. Then we switched on the B&W 803s and cranked it up a bit. I literally got goose bumps during Tchaikovsky's 1812 Overture and from the look on her face I could tell she had discovered true music magic. It's one of those moments that rarely come along.

We went back in and listened to the 804s again and it was like night and day. How could I ever consider that puny sound compared to what we'd just heard?

I couldn't believe the stark difference. I thought I had read enough reviews, etc to be familiar with the various models in that line but I was sorely mistaken. I knew the 803 had an extra driver in the tower but neither the B&W website nor my dealer shows them side-by-side and I never realized the huge size difference (50% more weight in the 803) and who knows what else I had missed. For an extra $2,500, there isn't a doubt in my mind which one to pick. And to think I nearly missed the boat out of sheer ignorance.

And I'll say that if Tannoy wants to sell me some speakers they'd better get a high-end dealer in Texas mui pronto. No way I'm buying an unheard speaker over what I listened to today.

I personally had 803 the entire lineup all these Years including 803n, 803s, 1st generation 803D and 803D2 current version. 803 speakers are great speakers even if you compare with his 802 brorher. The 802 has more bass but the sweet spot and staging is very similar. Personaly i love the 803d size and the look and its eazy to tune without you asking to someone to help you to setup and move around, big plus.

[sp8]

Originally Posted by ariess

I think 803D vs 804D is really a function of room size. Their components and design are pretty identical, but with enough power 803D can fill a big space. For a small room id recommend the 804D as you can sit just 8-9 feet away and the sound is fully integrated by there which would not be the case for 803D or 802D. I also think you can place 804D closer to a rear wall than the bigger guys without getting over powering bass reverb. My 804Ds in my small room, 18x10 feet with the 804's along the long wall are stunning with Audio Research tube gear and Transparent audio cables and having attended quite a few audio shows and dealer visits, I have not heard anything under 5 figures which match their combination of detail and warmth. But I heard them in a big room, probably 25x25 feet, once with the same components as mine and it was not the same. How big is your room?

My listening room measures 13 X 22 feet. The speakers are on the short wall and about the only place for speakers given the room configuration. I listened to the 804ds and the 805ds and prefer the 804ds. The 804ds are a big improvement over my 22 year old Paradigm Studio Monitors. I have ordered a McIntosh C2500 and MC 275 v.6 and and waiting for them to arrive. I really wasn't looking for new speakers until I heard how good the B & W speakers sound. I hope the 804ds will handle my room. If I go up the line I will have to wait for a good deal longer.

[Chicago]

Old Tex,
For what it's worth I auditioned the 803s (used), N802 (used), PMC Ob1i (used), 804D and 803 Diamond (current version) at my home. My room is 34'x15' with a ceiling that is 8' at one end and rises to 15' and back down to 12' so there is a lot of volume. Of that group I liked the 803 Diamond for a variety of reasons and I have owned them for about a year and I still love them. I am a Bryston guy but McIntosh is also a good pairing with them. As you may be aware they love current so make sure the amp is robust.

I listened to the 804D at the dealership in a 20'x10' room with a 8' ceiling, and I really liked them. However, in that same room I still preferred the 803 Diamond. They have since moved the 804D's to a fairly small (12'x10') room and they sound better in that room than the 803 Diamonds that were just too much in there.

All of the other speakers were also tested at the dealership in the 20'x10' room. At my house the PMC OB1i and the 804D got lost, they just couldn't fill the room with sound at a reasonable listening level. My better half nixed the N802. I then kept the 803s and 803 Diamonds for a few weeks before deciding to bust my budget for the 803 Diamonds. The used 803s were only about $4,000 and I had a really hard time convincing myself the 803 Diamonds were worth an additional $6,000. I am glad I went the way I did.

Good Listening,
Mike

[Blackstone]

The 803D is better than the 804D in every way. It is simply a question of budget.

[ariess]

I don't know how that could be true. They have the exact same 1" diamond tweeter and 6" Kevlar FST midrange. The only difference is in the bass drivers where they use rohacells, the 804D uses 2, 6.5" and the 803D uses 3, 7"

[Rod#S]

I wouldn't use a blanket statement such as the 803 is better in every way as some people find the 803 less balanced then the 804 with some experiencing bloated bass with the 803 but so many factors contribute to what we hear from our speakers. Examples are the room size, what's in the room, are there a lot of reflective or absorptive materials in the room, degree of toe in, distances from rear and side walls, inadequate amplification, etc.

Differences in the size of the cabinets, the matrix/bracing design inside the cabinet along with the different sized drivers can all act together to produce different sounds, a slightly different tonality if you will. Remember the mid crosses over to the bass at 350Hz and there is a lot of range below 350Hz that humans can hear so it's just not as straight forward as the 803 is a 804 with better bass extension not to mention the effect the cabinet design has on the mids. I'm not sure of the crossovers but if the cross over components are different as is the case between the 800 and 802 that too can lead to a different sound.

[raidho]

Hallo,

I prefer the 804DI. this speaker - with the 805di - is one of the VERY new and not a simple "uograde" of the 803d to 803DI.....the 804s and 805s in the Di tweever version make an amazing difference.

I had the 803s, 803d, 803di, 804d and the 802di.

The 804di is my fovorit speaker and hve a fine sound much better vs. the 803di.

@Blackstone: for me is not a question of budget. I purchase a 804di without a second thought even if the price was the same.

Style

[BVLDARI]

Originally Posted by raidho

Hallo,

I prefer the 804DI. this speaker - with the 805di - is one of the VERY new and not a simple "uograde" of the 803d to 803DI.....the 804s and 805s in the Di tweever version make an amazing difference.

I had the 803s, 803d, 803di, 804d and the 802di.

The 804di is my fovorit speaker and hve a fine sound much better vs. the 803di.

@Blackstone: for me is not a question of budget. I purchase a 804di without a second thought even if the price was the same.

Style

so you like 804d2 better than 802d2?

[dantes0929]

Originally Posted by BVLDARI

so you like 804d2 better than 802d2?

His room size plays a big roll in sound quality.

[ariess]

Raidho,

What you call the "804Di" is the 804D which came out about 3 years ago (2010)
and sells for $7500 (or the equivalent in other currency), yes? Unlike the 803 series, there was not an 804D in the prior line-up, only an 804S. So I am pretty certain there has only ever been one 804 with a "D" in the name, though some people refer to it as "D" or "Di" or even "D2" to indicate its part of the current line-up as of a few years ago.
I was confused because you said you once had the "804d" and now you have the "804di". Did you mean it was the "804s" that you had?

-Adam