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  #11  
Old 01-04-2021, 01:18 AM
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Default What are your goals with this hobby?

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Originally Posted by PHC1 View Post
Hmm, let me expand on what I mean Tony. Let's say you want a Porsche. Chances are, you have read the specs, you have read reviews, they are genuine, they describe facts and figures, the 0-60, the lateral acceleration numbers, the torque, the horsepower, heck one can even check what it did around the Ring as far as time to compare. You know well enough what you want out of that car and why you are buying it. The room/the performance, the looks, the style, the heritage, the pizzazz... Many reasons but mostly clear defined and verifiable.



What exactly are we buying with a very expensive power cord or a preamp we have not heard? Or any piece of gear for that matter. So in audio it boils down to an opinion of someone, somewhere with a very different audio system, who does not believe in blind testing or measurements, because we do not like measurements in audio. So trust his ears and hope he was being genuine when he described the "this blows that one out of the water"? Of course if the reality of things does not meet expectations.... then we need a more resolving system or better ears? That's to add insult to the wallet injury?


OK, I misunderstood. I thought your premise for this thread was what our goals were for our hobby, not the validity of how we make our choices.
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Last edited by Antonmb; 01-04-2021 at 01:33 AM.
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  #12  
Old 01-04-2021, 02:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Antonmb View Post
... My goals are to enjoy the music I love and have fun playing with cool equipment that helps me enjoy it even more. Too many people just way over-complicate and over-think what should be a fun hobby.
+1 Tony

I've been involved with learning about, playing or listening to music my entire life and my audio hobby is a way to continue that. Nowadays with the rise and proliferation of audio forums the hobby is also a social activity for many - no longer a solitary listening experience - and I see that as a good thing.

Serge - you should have stuck with the question in your title then sit back and enjoy the responses. ;-o
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  #13  
Old 01-04-2021, 07:31 AM
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Enjoyment of the overall experience: an emotional connection to the music, envisioning the performers live in my room, achieving an almost meditative state where I am totally present with the music. When the gear, the room and the recording all come together to create this experience then things are good. When the gear, room or recording get in the way, then something has to change.
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  #14  
Old 01-04-2021, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonmb View Post
OK, I misunderstood. I thought your premise for this thread was what our goals were for our hobby, not the validity of how we make our choices.
Are there no goals when one makes choices? Probably not judging by the proliferation of power cords costing $8k lately. Heck, there are even $120k speaker cable boxes that have knobs in them... Wonder how much validation goes into that kind of a purchase....
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  #15  
Old 01-04-2021, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveneumann View Post
Enjoyment of the overall experience: an emotional connection to the music, envisioning the performers live in my room, achieving an almost meditative state where I am totally present with the music. When the gear, the room and the recording all come together to create this experience then things are good. When the gear, room or recording get in the way, then something has to change.
Eloquently put. I do think we often like to change things for the sake of change and a fresh perspective or a new shiny box but that goes with any hobby.
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  #16  
Old 01-04-2021, 09:17 AM
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My goal in this hobby is that my room and equipment assist in engaging me with the music I play on that system. I know I have a good system, but clearly nowhere close to ‘the best”, but I can play music I love and enjoy that experience. For me, it is the engagement that I enjoy. I like holding an album cover and reading the liner notes. I enjoy recording and playing back music on my recently purchased R2R to compare how it sounds to the source. I try to understand why some sound better than the source and others not so much. But, while I love the convenience and reduced costs of streaming, I also know that for me, I do enjoy engaging with the actual media. I still read books, my Wine Spectator and Cigar Aficionado are still in print form. I just went through my more than 1000 cds and gave most all to my kids, who will most likely just sell them. But, I did keep and put into binders those cd’s that have special meaning. Those early Telarc recordings from Erich Kunzel, DMP recordings like Flim and the BB’s, first GRP recordings among a few others. Those recordings feel like almost a part of me, and just couldn’t let them go. I get those decisions and ways make me a bit old fashioned. But if we can decide what sounds “the best” based on our ears, then I should be able to decide “how” to enjoy this hobby is personal as well.
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  #17  
Old 01-04-2021, 09:18 AM
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Paul McGowan tries to tackle the question. Why do Professional Musicians ignore high end audio? https://www.psaudio.com/askpaul/why-...igh-end-audio/

Well, it is an interesting question...
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  #18  
Old 01-04-2021, 09:55 AM
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My view is that I'm the only one who has to like the way my system sounds. Having started at a very modest level, I chased upgrades to just about everything Serge mentioned over the years and have settled upon my current setup. I believe it's just about as good as my ears can perceive.

I bought my speakers and amp because I truly believed they were generational products that would last my lifetime (or whatever time in life I have left). They form the core of the system. I have no desire to change it, especially if it's just to get the newest latest bit of kit.

I also subscribe to the law of diminishing returns. I'm not wealthy enough to journey down that road, so I don't ever think about it.

Aside: I would like an offshore center console about 10 feet longer than the one I currently own.
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  #19  
Old 01-04-2021, 10:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreddieFerric View Post
My view is that I'm the only one who has to like the way my system sounds. Having started at a very modest level, I chased upgrades to just about everything Serge mentioned over the years and have settled upon my current setup. I believe it's just about as good as my ears can perceive.

I bought my speakers and amp because I truly believed they were generational products that would last my lifetime (or whatever time in life I have left). They form the core of the system. I have no desire to change it, especially if it's just to get the newest latest bit of kit.

I also subscribe to the law of diminishing returns. I'm not wealthy enough to journey down that road, so I don't ever think about it.

Aside: I would like an offshore center console about 10 feet longer than the one I currently own.
Excellent approach. I agree with your philosophy. This topic and the thread was not to impose my own personal beliefs, how or why someone should spend their money but to discuss the philosophy and goals (if there are any) of how one achieves long term satisfaction in this hobby.

All too often and over the decades, I have seen both sides of the camp. Folks who invested into gear that brought them pleasure and have held on to their systems while building their music libraries (streaming has completely changed that concept for me personally now) and folks who are proud audiophiles in the sense that "only" best quality recordings should be listened to on their systems and components must change in the quest for best sound.

I am personally far from the audiophile I was a few decades ago. Sure, it was always about the gear and sound from day one. I liked music.. I loved good sound even more it seemed.

How many audiophiles have a hundred or a few hundred albums/CDs that they listen to on a constant basis because of good sound? Listen a dozen times, buy a new cable... Listen a dozen times, buy a new DAC, another dozen times and the inner audiophile wants a new pair of speakers.. It never ends.

Now I love music and I enjoy good sound. As long as my system works, there is no pressing need to upgrade or change anything and I have not in a while now. There is a difference in my own approach, for sure. Not saying it is right or wrong, it is highly a personal choice.

Seems the main objective for many audiophiles is chasing good sound but judging by all the music documentaries I have ever watched, not one portrayed a high end system. Far from it. Musicians are involved with the emotional content of music, not "sound" that the typical audiophile is after.

That is what Paul McGowan failed to convey in his answer as to why the Musicians Ignore High End Audio.... It's not about the sound to the average person and it is definitely not about the sound for the musician. Only an audiophile tends to treat music as sound?
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  #20  
Old 01-04-2021, 02:57 PM
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My goals have changed substantially over time.

When I was a kid interested in electronics (age 10-13) it was about learning and playing with the gear - I built all of my stuff from kits or salvaged parts from radios and consoles.

Then I got interested in the music (13-present) still used the gear I built, and bought LP's, which I still have.

In college, (17- 21) having a good stereo was a kind of a status status symbol - how you spent your limited available funds was important! I spent mine on stereo gear and had a decent enough system with Ohm F's, and Dynakits, Thorens TT, etc. I still bought a lot of albums and so did everybody else. I think my focus was on the gear.

I started working in broadcast audio as newly minted EE, and learned a lot about the craft and what made things sound good or bad. All objective folks in the business, no tweakers. I got exposed to a lot of great systems, but since the gear was all work, the focus shifted back to the music.

I did some upgrades over time but the focus was still on the music. The gear was what I did for a living, so I didn't mess with it much in my free time.

Fast forward to the 2000's and I wasn't working in audio design anymore and I had enough disposable income to mess with gear again, so everything got upgraded.

The resulting equipment-focused upgrade merry-go-round was a very painful time for me. Most of the upgrades were downgrades.
I changed out my Adcom GFP-750 for a McIntosh C 2200. Total downgrade.
I changed my Classe' Model 15 for a McIntosh MC 2102. Another total downgrade.
Vienna Acoustics Beethoven to Wilson Sophia 2 - expensive parallel move.

While all this was going on I did a bunch of soul searching and decided what I really wanted was a great listening experience. I had been going to classical concerts and live jazz venues for years. So I started to really think about what gave me joy.

"Great" for me was a laid back musical system with realistic instrument tone.

I got there about a decade ago and was able to focus on the music again.

I've spent the last 5 years getting my digital playback front end to sound great, with a few targeted upgrades that were truly upgrades. C 1100, MC 2301, SF Amati Futura's.

All in service of a great listening experience. That's my goal now.
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