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  #11  
Old 07-24-2020, 10:09 AM
JemHadar JemHadar is offline
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Default Auralic Aries G2.1 vs. Grimm MU1

Going on these field trips with Bart is always a blast. When he invited me to join him in assessing the Grimm MU1 versus the Auralic Aries G2.1 it was definitely something to look forward to.

Although the gear used in the comparison, bar the Auralic and the Mola Mola, was unfamiliar to me, the ability to swap out and replace components made it easy to pinpoint any changes. Not that we ever went back to the Auralic after the MU1 had strut its stuff.

Before delving into the Grimm MU1 proper, some observations about the complete system.

The HEGEL H590 is a mighty fine piece of kit. The internal DAC is most certainly not an afterthought as a direct comparison with the Mola Mola Tambaqui illustrated how brutal and unforgiving the law of diminishing returns can be. The HEGEL DAC’s presentation was more forward and narrow/intimate versus the Tambaqui’s open, expansive but slightly more distant soundstage. But we are talking subtle differences here as both DACs left nothing to be desired. It would all come down to personal preference. If you are considering an integrated amp the HEGEL H590 is a worthy and impressive contender for sure.

I appreciated the midrange and treble of the Vivid Audio Kaya45’s, however their compact size did not deliver the heft and impact in the bass that would be more desirable with bigger listening spaces such as the one at “Listening Matters”. It is just physics at work and not a critique of the Kaya45 abilities as such which probably are more aligned with smaller spaces. As Bart owns Vivid speakers and is familiar with their sound, the benefits of using them during the demo outweighed the cons.

I use an Auralic Aries G2 as wireless Roon Endpoint, paired with a McIntosh MDA1000 DAC and MXA60 integrated, in my Man Cave/Homework Office to great satisfaction. However in this particular demo setup the Aries was, dare I say, slightly underwhelming...and that was before having heard the Grimm MU1. Not that there was anything wrong with it, it was just OK, delivering the performance one would expect at its price point.

The MU1 on the other hand...it literally just took the first notes of a track to realise that this was something different entirely and very special. I will spare you the audiophile babble and leave it at this: the Grimm MU1 makes you want to listen to music more. It allows for the music to seduce you and draw you in. Through a sense of presence and involvement the music establishes an emotional connection that just wasn’t there with the Aries.

By Ben van Leliveld’s reckoning, it would take the full Auralic stack with clock and upsampler to approach or match the performance of the MU1 and then some. This realisation shines a different light on the asking price for the MU1.

The design brief of the MU1 is unique though and will benefit specific use cases more than others.

If you own Grimm Active speakers and wish to embrace the world of streaming and get lost in the Roonverse in particular, the MU1 is a no-brainer. I have experienced this combo at two separate occasions and the performance is just off the charts. Don’t take my word for it; if you have to chance to audition such a setup in optimal conditions, you are in for a treat.

If you are intent on using the DSP features of Roon and/or own a library that requires Nucleus+ type performance, the MU1 most definitely is not for you. As the resident NUC does not feature any form of active or extended passive cooling I can only surmise it is a very low power version of Intel’s Next Unit of Computing. Taking a tally of the number of endpoints the MU1 will have to service seems prudent too.

Although the chassis is rather nice, the top mounted control wheel could make rack mounting a challenge. A provision to add an infrared cell is made. However at this price point a remote or an app that allows for changing the inputs from your listening position should just come with the package.

For all its technological prowess, the user interface of the MU1 is rather clunky and feels like an afterthought at best and an unfinished project at worst. As I understand it, development is continuously ongoing and improvements are bound to be implemented. But I cannot shake the feeling that despite years of development the product could have benefited from some TLC finishing touches as far as the user experience goes.

Some design choices are, IMHO, a bit idiosyncratic. The deliberate choice not to display cover art (in its defense; possibly the spec of the display used is not suited for this). The choice not to support USB audio which precludes the use of e.g. Dynaudio hubs, reasoning being that USB negates the magic sauce of the MU1. That might well be, but it limits the number of use cases; some of these use cases being more about convenience than hardcore performance.

Now what is this magic sauce that elevates the MU1 to these extraordinary heights of performance; that would be a combination of Grimm clocks and bespoke up/down sampling algorithms running on a FPGA chip. The idea being that the heavy lifting is done by the MU1 relieving the DAC of these duties.

To reap maximum rewards the use of the AES3 outputs is recommended as the serial data stream contains the bit clock. Given that the DAC slaves to this bit clock, it will benefit from its superior timing. Best to check the internal architecture of your DAC because not all DAC’s will slave their clocks to bit clocks embedded in the data stream and only use it to buffer data correctly.

Similarly, as the Roon RAAT protocol moves buffers of audio asynchronously, the clock advantage for the DAC is lost when a Roon Ready DAC is connected through Ethernet. However, from the demo, I can only conclude that it is the nature of the up/down sampling calculations of which the outcomes are reclocked by the Grimm clocks, that make the MU1 outstanding, regardless of how the bits arrive at the DAC.

I wonder if the inclusion of the Roon Core is absolutely necessary for the whole unit to function. A version without the Roon Core, but with Roon End Point (rendering) capability, at let’s say half the price, would give the dCS Network Bridge a run for its money. As such the Grimm MU1 occupies a very specific place in the Roonverse with no real DAC-less competitors as far as I can tell.

The Grimm MU1 is a music player that makes no apologies for its idiosyncratic way of doing things. It marries a Roon Server of moderate ability with an exceptional up/down sampling solution, packaged in an elegant one box offering.

If you are a Grimm speaker user the MU1 is as good as unavoidable. Besides Grimm speakers, depending on the DAC or Roon End Point one uses your mileage may vary, but no doubt it will delight those seeking an emotional connection with their favourite music but not requiring Nucleus+ type performance.

If you haven’t done so already, do check out the releases on the trptk label of which Ben van Leliveld, our host for the day, is the driving force. Trptk releases stunning recordings of world class performances.

It was a fun day and congratulations to Bart with the purchase of his Grimm MU1.

Kudos to Ben van Leliveld and his crew for taking care of us.

Last edited by JemHadar; 07-25-2020 at 05:43 AM.
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  #12  
Old 07-24-2020, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antonmb View Post
Excellent review Bart. It sounds like you had a great time and experienced a revelation regarding streamers. Congratulations on your purchase.

Tony, thank you!
Streaming is definitely the future.
But I'm sure my wife and I are going to continue to have those cosy silver disc nights, where we each in turn choose an album from the racks.
For old times' sake.

The CD player will be connected to the MU1 though, its effect is addictive...
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  #13  
Old 07-24-2020, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crwilli View Post
Congratulations Bart! It’s great that you were able to audition two products like this and hear a clear choice. It makes the purchase so much easier and gives you confidence.

Craig, thanks a lot.
You are also spoiled with a very good streamer.
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AV: Hegel C-53, Marantz AV8802A, Oppo BDP-203EU, Pioneer Kuro 60", Vivid Audio C1 & V1w's, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse, SE & E
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  #14  
Old 07-24-2020, 04:35 PM
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Excellent analysis and remarks Jacques.
I thoroughly enjoyed our road trip.
Thank you for helping me!
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Stereo: Hegel H590, Grimm Audio MU1, Mola Mola Tambaqui, Burmester 948 - V3 & V6 racks, Vivid Audio G2 Giyas, REL Carbon Special (pair), Silent Angel Bonn N8 Ethernet Switch & Forester F1, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse IC and SE SC, Furutech Digiflux
AV: Hegel C-53, Marantz AV8802A, Oppo BDP-203EU, Pioneer Kuro 60", Vivid Audio C1 & V1w's, Wireworld Platinum Eclipse, SE & E
Second system (veranda): Halgorythme preamp and monoblocks, Burmester 061, Avalon Avatar, Sharkwire & Wireworld cables
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  #15  
Old 07-26-2020, 06:56 AM
Eelco Grimm Eelco Grimm is offline
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Bart and Jacques, thank you very much for your in depth review and praise for the MU1. I am happy you enjoyed the demo at Listening Matters so much!

Jacques, I like to respond to a few remarks you made on the MU1 design. Please feel free to ask me for more details whenever aspects of the MU1 are unclear, on this forum or offline.

First of all, the MU1 is perfectly capable of running the DSP features of Roon. I must say I was underwhelmed by for instance the quality of the room correction, but the MU1 has no problem running it. The MU1 is also tested with very large music libraries and has no trouble supporting them. The only thing we recommend is to let it run overnight for indexing because in general Roon is not very responsive during that process. There are some options in Roon to ‘throttle’ the index process, which helps a bit, but still it’s better to just let it run overnight imo.

Furthermore the NUC in the MU1 is well passively cooled on the chassis, and it is the very latest NUC model. It has no problem serving many end points simultaneously, and a few customers are indeed using it as the Roon server for their full home. Of course a full blown PC with fan cooling will offer higher performance, but it will usually be overkill for audio playback, even at high res - and you don’t want such a noisy device in your living room. In fact the whole idea for the MU1 was born when small passively cooled PC’s were getting powerfull enough to run this task.

Remote controls are in the make. Indeed there will be an infrared interface option, but before that the MU1 will get its own web page to set preferences (also those of a connected LS1) via a browser. This will facilitate source selection and volume control as well, and integration with 3rd party home automation systems. Volume and source control from an iOS device lock screen is on the wish list.

The decision to not display cover art on the screen is entirely mine. I just happen to find it ugly :-) In my world the tablet is for interfacing with the catalog, the device is for rapid access to key features like volume control, mute and source selection and a quick view of what’s playing. USB DACs are supported, but in that case you just bought a very expensive NUC cabinet. There’s no limit to using them though.

A MU1 without Roon Core would not cost half of the price I’m afraid. Our aim was to limit the amount of boxes in the system, to increase elegancy. We were the last company that was allowed to offer a combined Roon Core/End Point without large hdmi display interface and I’m glad for it.

Jacques, I’d love to learn why you feel as if the user interface of the MU1 is ‘an afterthought’. I admit that it is still in development, but in our plans it formed the center piece from the beginning. There’s a few UI features on the way still this year that no other manufacturer offer and that will truly change the way you can interact with your music. The MU1 OS is built from the ground up based on a Linux ‘Tiny OS’ system, to give us full control on everything that’s going on inside. Admittedly, this means development takes more time, but we are in this for the long run. In our next update we offer a radically rewritten ‘internal control program’ that brings ultimate stability (we adopted a special programming style with much less dependencies). Our cooperation with Roon Labs is becoming more tight, with the mutual intention to make it a true flagship Roon product.

Again, thank you Bart and Jacques for your enthusiasm about the MU1’s sonic performance. We intend to bring the user experience of the MU1 to the same level as the sound quality. Feedback like yours is well appreciated and we will continue improving it.

All the best,
Eelco Grimm
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  #16  
Old 07-26-2020, 06:36 PM
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Eelco Grimm... Welcome to AA!
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  #17  
Old 07-27-2020, 08:03 AM
JemHadar JemHadar is offline
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Default Auralic Aries G2.1 vs. Grimm MU1

Eelco, Welcome to Audio Aficionado and thank you for taking the time to join this conversation, clarify certain topics and share your insights. It is very much appreciated.

The consumer audio industry is one of the few left where brilliant minds, mad scientists, maverick designers, visionaries find a place and opportunity to realise their vision and delight customers with the fruits of their labour. However it is an industry nonetheless; business rules apply and the bottom line has the final say. I find this aspect as fascinating as the merits of the gear itself. I guess this fascination is borne out of my professional occupation.

I’m not a specialist but help teams of specialists develop and execute strategies, deliver projects etc. Everything has a story, a narrative. It is my job to make sure these narratives survive the boardroom; that the people who sign off adopt these narratives as their own. Most likely we “crash and burn” within minutes if we miss the mark. If the team gets it right, very few questions remain. The process of getting it right is relentless and merciless and to this day two mantras rule “expect the unexpected” and “assumption is the mother of all...” (I think you can fill in the blanks). We prepare by asking a simple question, “Why?” ad infinitum, sometimes ad nauseam.

Why this rambling introduction? When I am in the market for a new piece of gear, I want to understand the narrative. Some of my remarks may seem trivial, petty, nitpicky, whimsical or farfetched. However I cannot switch off my way of looking at things; I guess you could consider it an occupational hazard. In my job, we (the Team) always aim to do better and I hope you can appreciate the spirit in which my remarks are made. Anyway, who ever said making an audiophile purchase was an exercise in rationality?[emoji854]

As you are taking the time to participate on AA it only seems fair I share my personal purchase decision making process in more depth. Bart has a MU1 on order; I’m still on the fence, but then, my use case is different.

Before diving in deeper, there is one technical specification that is not clear to me. Will Ethernet connected Roon End Points and USB connected devices receive up/down sampled data, or do only the AES3 outputs benefit from this feature?

With regard to the usage of the USB port as a digital audio output; here the narrative stutters. When reading reviews, forum posts, marketing content, even the manual, the story is confusing. For me Roon is all about convenience. Most if not all music producing devices in my house are serviced by my Roon Nucleus+. In our guest room a set of Dynaudio XEO wireless speakers were almost up for sale if not for the ability to connect the Dynaudio XEO hub to a Nucleus USB port. Does it qualify for critical listening? Hardly, but it works flawlessly, it is convenient, it is fun. As the hub is recognised by Roon I could bring the XEO ecosystem into the Roonverse.

On the topic of the user interface, or more broadly the user experience; from modest dabblings with this matter I know it is very very challenging to get it right. It is not only about interaction, but also about visual cues, tactility, keeping it simple, feedback, User acceptance and User adoption. As Bart pointed out in his review; the MU1 is an expensive piece of kit. Expectations should be high; criteria and features that come into play are partly dictated by competing products.

As it stands now, I would prefer the MU1 without display all together. I asked Ben if it was possible to switch off the display. At first I was not a fan of big displays with cover art either. But now with the Auralic Aries G2 in my headphone setup I have come to appreciate its advantages. I no longer have to switch to my iPad to see where I am in the playlist; it is convenient as it doesn’t break the flow or blind me in a darkened room.

The way the screen is mounted, the perceived quality of the screen; IMHO is just not up to standard at this price point. At least I would expect an option to display cover art or not. If I’m not mistaken long tittles are truncated on the display. For me, in its current iteration, it is more of a distraction than value adding.

Comparisons between the Grimm control knob and the Naim control wheel are bound to be made. I own a first gen MUSO and the control wheel is inviting to use, self-explanatory and just a marvel of design and execution. The way it carries over DNA from their reference system is brilliant marketing. It feels just right, one doesn’t need a manual to operate it and it could have come right out of an Apple or Tesla Design Studio. When a unit has only one means of tactile control, it is tempting to compound functionality in that one control device. Although I can appreciate the engineering cleverness of the Grimm approach, you lost me at “rotate while pressed”.

However all this wouldn’t matter that much was it not for the elephant in the room. Possibly remotes are a thing of the past but the absence of a native control app, iOS or Android alike, does the MU1 a great disservice. It just breaks the narrative. IMHO, bringing to market an unfinished or incomplete value proposition with the promise of future upgradeability is like walking a tightrope during a blizzard; very few companies get away with it.

As far as the capabilities of the resident NUC go. By introducing the Nucleus and Nucleus+, Roonlabs has in effect set two benchmarks for two distinct types of users. I kind of suspected the chassis would be used for passive cooling but could not be sure. It would help though to publish the capabilities of the resident NUC in terms of the metrics used by Roonlabs to define their respective Nucleus versions; clear, simple and no surprises.

As I already use a Nucleus+ (the blistering fast indexing is important to me) it is hard to gauge what I would lose, if anything, by switching to the MU1. From what I have read on the www, I am not the only one musing about a core-less version. I am not privy to the internal workings of the MU1 but to have a Roon End Point capable of taking on the dCS Network Bridge and Auralic Aries G2.1 at a comparable price point with the up/down sampling capabilities of the MU1 would be very appealing.

I’m confident the MU1 will find and enchant its audience. I look forward to the future developments, announced in your post, and wish you and the Grimm team all the success this extraordinary accomplishment deserves.

Last edited by JemHadar; 07-28-2020 at 01:57 AM.
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  #18  
Old 07-28-2020, 11:44 AM
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Eelco, welcome to AA!

Thank you for the explanation.
Do you have an idea when you will be ready with the multi-channel update of the MU1?
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Old 07-29-2020, 04:31 PM
Eelco Grimm Eelco Grimm is offline
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Dear Jacques,

Since I’m on holidays just a brief answer.

The main output of the MU1 is its AES3 outputs, since they offer the low jitter clock. The USB outputs can be connected to a USB DAC if you like, but the MU1 will then just offer standard Roon performance.

The functionality of the MU1 main button is the same as that of the LS1r remote. People like it when they are used to it. The responsiveness is further tuned in the upcoming software release. Grimm Audio is a much smaller company than Naim. We cannot afford to wait till the software of a device like the MU1 is developed to perfectness. Besides: customers who heard the beta units literally forced us to release it even before the v1.0 firmware was finished. They wanted their unit so badly they could not wait. The sound quality of the clock and upsampler were as intended right from the start.

I hope this helps to clarify our choices.

All the best,
Eelco
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Old 07-29-2020, 04:39 PM
Eelco Grimm Eelco Grimm is offline
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Dear Bart,

When we release the multichannel software it needs to offer stable performance up to multichannel DXD and DSD256. To guarentee this super high performance demand we first need to finish our own developed DMA driver for the FPGA. However, we decided to rework the control data system first because this enhances the system for more customers. I expect the multichannel software to be released this autumn.

All the best,
Eelco
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