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Old 12-09-2009, 10:37 AM
PHC1 PHC1 is offline
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Default HDMI extenders/Dual Cat5/6 question

I need some guidance in what is a better approach to feed video over longer cables. HDMI extenders? Dual Cat5/6? Fiber optic extenders? Some of the TV sets will be at least 40-50ft away from cable boxes/PS3s, etc...

Thanks!

Last edited by PHC1; 12-09-2009 at 10:41 AM.
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Old 12-09-2009, 11:06 AM
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Extron Electronics - DVI/HDMI Signals over Twisted-Pair Cable: "The Year of the CAT"
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Old 12-09-2009, 11:21 AM
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Should be a good info source
HDMI :: Installers :: Running Long Cable Lengths

HDMI
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Old 12-09-2009, 05:31 PM
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Thanks!
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  #5  
Old 12-09-2009, 05:38 PM
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The best solution for long length video is Cat 5/6
__________________
Ivan
FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES

Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES
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  #6  
Old 01-30-2010, 12:23 PM
KingRT KingRT is offline
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I ran cat 5 and extenders (milestec) (sp) and had major handshake problems.
I had to go back to HDMI cables.
It was all pro installed. (My research said do not use it cat5 /extenders , but he insisted by the adage "Do not believe what you read on the web")

So count me as one, who it did not work out for.
Check to see which equipment it is known to have a problem on the handshake cat5 /extenders.
Example the PS3= no picture but sound 1/2 the time.

Last edited by KingRT; 02-01-2010 at 10:05 PM.
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  #7  
Old 01-30-2010, 12:41 PM
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I may wind up having some problems with copy protected content in the future, but for now I send HD video (limited to 1080i or 720p) to my remote TV's via component video. I have some 60 ft. + runs and use HD distribution amplifiers like this: Amazon.com: CE LABS AV901HD HDTV/Component A/V Distribution Amplifier: Electronics

I'm not able to send 1080p video this way, but it's somewhat problematic sending 1080p for long distances over HDMI anyway. I agree with Ivan's advice to run a more than sufficient number of Cat 5/6 cables to each remote location, but I believe you will find the component cables to work very robustly and worth installing as a backup if nothing else.
__________________
John

Houston Upstairs - C1000C/T, MX170, MC1.2KW x 4, MC501 x 2, MC252, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, MEN220, MPC1500, XRT1K's, XCS1K, XLS320's, Gotham, Sony VPL-VW675ES, Sony XBR-55X930E, Panasonic DP-UB9000, Apple TV 4K, Roon Core on Nucleus & MS600
Houston Downstairs - Den (Zone A): MX122, MR88, MCD500, MVP871, MC207, DD18, Sony XBR-75Z9D, OPPO BDP-203, Sonos Port, Apple TV 4K, Sooloos MS200, B&W 805 Diamond x 2, B&W HTM4 Diamond, B&W CWM8 x 2; Living Room (Zone B): Sony XBR-65Z9D, MC402 & XR200's

Austin Theater - MX180, MC8207; Anthem P5; Lumagen Radiance Pro; Kaleidescape Strato; OPPO UDP-203; Sooloos MS200; Apple TV 4K; Sonos Connect; Paradigm Signature S8 (2), C5, SIG-1.5R-v.3 (4) SIG-1.5R-30 v.3 (4), SUB2; Sony VPL-VW1100ES, XR-85X95K; Screen Innovations Black Diamond 2.35:1
Austin Den - Marantz AV7701, MM7055; Paradigm Studio 10 v5 (2), Studio CC-590 v5, RVC-12SQ, SA-10R (2); Sony XBR-65Z9D
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  #8  
Old 01-30-2010, 02:32 PM
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HDMI runs over 25'-30' won't be able to push enough data for 1080p much less the next big step. The Cat 5/6 concept with high mhz modulators at both ends is the answer.
__________________
Ivan
FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES

Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES
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Old 01-30-2010, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterlu View Post
HDMI runs over 25'-30' won't be able to push enough data for 1080p much less the next big step. The Cat 5/6 concept with high mhz modulators at both ends is the answer.
I can't disagree with you about that, and I also recommend running multiple Cat 5/6 cables, but I would still run legacy component video and analog stereo audio along with them while I was at it. I have spoken with several installers about this, and their and my experiences indicate that component video is, at least currently, the most reliable method for 1080i & 720p content. Is it a solution for 1080p, 3D, or 4K? Certainly not, but my main use right now for multi-zone whole house video distribution is satellite TV, which save for a couple of movie channels @1080p/24 is 1080i or 720p for HD content.

I have a feeling we are going to go through several generations of modulators before we have a completely robust solution for high resolution HDMI transmission by Cat5/6, although I hope I am wrong (which is frequently the case).

Is there a specific Cat 5/6 HDMI transmission solution you can currently recommend, Ivan? I'd love to learn more as my knowledge on this is at least 6 months old, and things are changing quickly on this front.
__________________
John

Houston Upstairs - C1000C/T, MX170, MC1.2KW x 4, MC501 x 2, MC252, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, MEN220, MPC1500, XRT1K's, XCS1K, XLS320's, Gotham, Sony VPL-VW675ES, Sony XBR-55X930E, Panasonic DP-UB9000, Apple TV 4K, Roon Core on Nucleus & MS600
Houston Downstairs - Den (Zone A): MX122, MR88, MCD500, MVP871, MC207, DD18, Sony XBR-75Z9D, OPPO BDP-203, Sonos Port, Apple TV 4K, Sooloos MS200, B&W 805 Diamond x 2, B&W HTM4 Diamond, B&W CWM8 x 2; Living Room (Zone B): Sony XBR-65Z9D, MC402 & XR200's

Austin Theater - MX180, MC8207; Anthem P5; Lumagen Radiance Pro; Kaleidescape Strato; OPPO UDP-203; Sooloos MS200; Apple TV 4K; Sonos Connect; Paradigm Signature S8 (2), C5, SIG-1.5R-v.3 (4) SIG-1.5R-30 v.3 (4), SUB2; Sony VPL-VW1100ES, XR-85X95K; Screen Innovations Black Diamond 2.35:1
Austin Den - Marantz AV7701, MM7055; Paradigm Studio 10 v5 (2), Studio CC-590 v5, RVC-12SQ, SA-10R (2); Sony XBR-65Z9D
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  #10  
Old 01-30-2010, 03:32 PM
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I still have the very best component cable (approx 45') run to my G90 in Florida. In fact it is 5 cables (R,G,B,H,V) all terminated with BNC's. Honestly there is no contest when A/B that to running all digital from source to lens.

A good backup though none the less. I'm using some high end super shielded Cat 6 in both locations. The brand escapes me at the moment, but I purchased 1000' feet & it was less than the best Wireworld HDMI cable.

My modulators are also quite inexpensive, around $350 for both ends. The best digital card for my projector cost about $500.

So the big expense is only the projector. Run at least 6 Cat 5/6 cables to the projector for expansion ie: 4000p, 3D, control, etc.

Hope that helps.
__________________
Ivan
FLORIDA
MX136, MC1.2KW(10) MC2KW(2), MCD1100, MS750(2) MVP881, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, HT-2 SUBS(2) HT3F(2) WS350(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) XCS350(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" MOTORIZED SCREEN, CINEMA-TECH SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: ACCUPHASE A300 AMPS, C3900 PRE-AMP, DP1000 CD/SACD TRANSPORT, DC1000 DIGITAL PROCESSOR, DG-68 DIGITAL EQUALIZER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, PS1230 POWER SUPPLY, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, WW PLATINUM CABLES
CAPE COD

MX150, MC501(2) MC1.2KW(10) MC2301(2) MR88, MVP881, MCD1100, MDA1000, C1000C/P/T, MPC1500, ESOTERIC K-01X 30th ANNIVERSARY (BLACK) SACD/CD PLAYER, G02-X CLOCK, HT3F(2) XRT2K, XCS2K, XR27(2) JL GOTHAM v2 SUBS(2) JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(4) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) KALEIDESCAPE STRATO & TERRA SERVERS 80-TB, LUMAGEN RADIANCE SCALER, SONY VPH-G90U 4K PROJECTOR, STEWART 120" SCREEN, SONUS FABER STRADIVARI, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, FORTRESS SEATING, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Analog Rig: CLEARAUDIO INNOVATION WOOD, UNIVERSAL ARM w/ Da VINCI' CART, 2nd UNIVERSAL ARM w/ GOLDFINGER STATEMENT CART, HRS-MXR REFERENCE RACK-GLOSS BLACK w/ M3X SHELVES, AESTHETIX RHEA SIG PHONO-PRE, BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Reference System: BURMESTER 911MK3 AMP(3), 088 PRE-AMP, 089 CD PLAYER, 100 PHONO PRE-AMP, 948 POWER CONDITIONER, ACCUPHASE DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, AVID ACUTUS REFERENCE SP TT, GRAHAM PHANTOM II SUPREME ARM, BENZ MICRO LP-S CART, GRANDIOSO P1X/D1X STACK, G1X RUBIDIUM MASTER CLOCK, N05 NETWORK PLAYER, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS-SXR CUSTOM RACK w/ M3X SHELVES, SONUS FABER AIDA SPEAKERS, JL FATHOM F113v2 SUBS(2) SOUND ANCHOR STANDS(2) WW PLATINUM CABLES

Library System: GRANDIOSO M1 MONOBLOCK AMPS, C1 LINESTAGE PRE-AMP, K1X CD/SACD PLAYER, G1 MASTER RUBIDIUM CLOCK, E02 PHONO-PRE, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, AERIAL ACOUSTICS 20T V2, AERIAL SW12 SUBS(2), CANTON REF K1’s, VPI HRX TT w/ SDS POWER SUPPLY, ORTOFON CADENZA BLACK CART, KLAUDIO RCM, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2, SHUNYATA OMEGA QR’s, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Esoteric/Bryston System: ESOTERIC C02-X PRE-AMP, P-02X TRANSPORT, D02-X DAC, G02-X CLOCK, BRYSTON 28B3 CUBED MONOBLOCK AMPS(4), BRYSTON BHA-1 HEADPHONE AMP, SHUNYATA DENALI 6000/S v2(2) EVEREST 8000 POWER CONDITIONER(2) ALTAIRA CG & SG HUBS, AMR-DP777-SE DAC, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, TAD REFERENCE ONE MK2 LOUDSPEAKERS, QUADRASPIRE RACK, WW PLATINUM CABLES
Accuphase/Canton System: ACCUPHASE E800 INTEGRATED, DP570 CD/SACD PLAYER, T1200 FM STEREO TUNER, DG-68 VOICING EQUALIZER, PS530 POWER SUPPLY, CANTON REF K3’s, CANTON REF K5’s, SILENZIO MUSIC SERVER, HRS MXR REFERENCE MAHOGHANY RACK w/ M3X2 SHELVES, WW GOLD CABLES
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