Comparison FLAC vs CD

[jdandy]

I spent two hours today, A/B'ing between the MS750 through the MCD500 DACs, and the MCD500 playing the same music direct. The comment Serge made, "more air up top, better bass" sums it up pretty well. The differences are subtle, not dramatic, and for anyone not weaned on a MDA1000 or MCD500 the difference might not garner any attention at all. But when doing direct A/B comparisons, there is a slight loss of inner space between instruments and voices, and a softening of the bass that is noticable. I even sense a tiny loss of dynamic range as well. CD's still represent the premium source when directly compared with FLAC file playback, even through the MCD500 DACs.

The convenience of the MS750 is where its real value exists, plus the fact that it is a great playback machine in its own right. I'm with Jim when it comes to the easy access to the MS750 content through three different Sonos Zone Players throughtout my home. From any one of those locations I have complete access to all the music on my MS750. That is hard to beat. When friends are over for dinner, the MS750 jukebox feature keeps the tunes rolling without any fuss. The MS750 is definately about convenience.

When I am busy about the house, I will listen to the MS750 more than any other source. When I park my rear in the sweet spot, it is CD's or SACD's I choose over all other sources. Why would I want to listen to anything but the very best I have when I'm in the sweet spot?

[David]

Originally Posted by jdandy

I spent two hours today, A/B'ing between the MS750 through the MCD500 DACs, and the MCD500 playing the same music direct. The comment Serge made, "more air up top, better bass" sums it up pretty well. The differences are subtle, not dramatic, and for anyone not weaned on a MDA1000 or MCD500 the difference might not garner any attention at all. But when doing direct A/B comparisons, there is a slight loss of inner space between instruments and voices, and a softening of the bass that is noticable. I even sense a tiny loss of dynamic range as well. CD's still represent the premium source when directly compared with FLAC file playback, even through the MCD500 DACs.

The convenience of the MS750 is where its real value exists, plus the fact that it is a great playback machine in its own right. I'm with Jim when it comes to the easy access to the MS750 content through three different Sonos Zone Players throughtout my home. From any one of those locations I have complete access to all the music on my MS750. That is hard to beat. When friends are over for dinner, the MS750 jukebox feature keeps the tunes rolling without any fuss. The MS750 is definately about convenience.

When I am busy about the house, I will listen to the MS750 more than any other source. When I park my rear in the sweet spot, it is CD's or SACD's I choose over all other sources. Why would I want to listen to anything but the very best I have when I'm in the sweet spot?

It seems to me that at least in theory, optical should be inferior to hard drive play back coming out of memory. I say this only as a lay person based on stuff I read regarding jitter. In the end the results you are getting might speak more to SPDIF or the connections, or even compressed flac.

The problem may be the SPDIF and/or an inferior connection. If I understand this correctly the 750 is sending data to the MCD500 via spdif coax. Internally, in the MCD500 there may be no conversion to SPDIF. Don't most cd players move data via I2s bus internally which is superior to SPDIF? I2s could replace SPDIF . Also Ron C. said that a BNC connection is superior to the coax on the MDA1000. I don't know if the MCD500 takes BNC connectors.

Last thought: I don't want you to make you work too hard, but what if you compared uncompressed wave files to cd instead of flac.

[jdandy]

David.......The dual quad DACs in the MCD 500 reclock all inputs, so I believe I'm safe saying it is not a jitter problem. The MDA1000 does have one balanced digital xlr input, plus a choice of coaxial and optical inputs, but no BNC input. The MCD500 does not have the balanced digital xlr input, but has a coaxial and optical input.

I am not a computer engineer, or code compiler, so I can not speak with authority about compression schemes, whether FLAC, wave, apple lossless, or otherwise. Logic tells me that unless a hard drive file is written bit for bit from a CD or some other digital source, there is some sort of compression algorithm taking place. To my ears, the FLAC file compression scheme is excellent, but not without its signature being imparted on the music.

As for wave or lossless files, I do not use my computer to store music files.

[1KW]

Originally Posted by jdandy

David.......

As for wave or lossless files, I do not use my computer to store music files.

Apple computer's lossless mode of recording music, to me sounds every bit as good as redbook CD on my sonos played via the DAC on the MCD500. The current software on the sonos limits playback to 16/44.

You have to remember to do one thing to here 24/96 from your computer. Go into the audio midi set up in applications and adjust the audio device to 2 ch 24 bit and format to 96000 HZ for both the built in input and output on your computer. If you don't do this you can not listen to HD music from your computer from HD downloads etc. . I then plug the toslink output of my computer into the MCD500, presto SACD quality from your computer.

[-E-]

I lot of people do not have the ability to upsample before going to the PCM digital output stage...

That is where a quality sound card comes in (and some are more equal than others, let's just say).

[Still-One]

I am agreeing with Dan's Post #13. Somehow FLAC and Apple Lossless seem to impart a sound on the data. I am not sure if it is in the compression/uncompress action, most experts say no, or is it in the conversion process of getting the laser to read the pits and bump off a CD, then converting that to the digital data that the compression algorithms will be used on.

I do know that my Yamaha HD-CDR1500 which saves CD's uncompressed (bit for bit) sounds better than the MS-300 via either units analog outputs or when the data is sent via both units digital outs to the MCD-500 DAC's. It is not a big difference but it seems to be there.

[Dj_AmTraX]

I rip all my CDs to AIFF (uncompressed). The sound is still not as good as a CD.

[JimJ]

I honestly can't tell a difference between FLAC and CD on the setups I've tried it on, although none were using quite the level of gear you guys have

I just rip using EAC secure mode at the highest settings.