MC501's or New Speakers?

[jdandy]

ZenZoo.......My recommendation to purchase the MC501 amps before the speakers was based on your stated budget of $6K to $8K. I felt that, even at the $8K mark, your budget would not support the caliber of speakers you might seek to rise to the level of your source.

There is no denying that speakers offer the largest variable in your system's sound, and implementing accurate physical actions is always a greater challenge than implementing accurate electronic actions. A speaker's sound, and the way you hear that sound are more subjective than any other part of an audio system. Obviously, the choice of speakers is extremely important, but I did not feel an $8K budget would get you in the ballpark with speakers, and that's why I chose the amps first.

[ZenZoo]

It's nice to get home from work and have so much great information from you guys to think about and consider.

To respond to some of the previous comments... yea, I'm still on a budget and agree that in the $6K range I could find a good used pair of 501's, but to get speakers I'd truly be happy with and take a big step up from my B&W 703's, I figured I'd have to spend $8-$12K or more. Now if I could find the Wilson Sophia 2's or similar around the $6K range, I'd probably choose those instead. I'm certainly going to look into the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest to see if that's possible. I have wanted to go to CES in Vegas for years, but always have work conflicts with other shows at that time. Granted, that's more electronics than audiophile equipment...

As for room treatment and speaker set-up, I'd say I'm 85% there! I'm certainly not a professional and have never used a Audio Control RTA or the like (although I'm interested in learning), but I did pay for consulting from Rives audio who designed my room to the square inch and gave detailed instructions on how to build the soffit in the ceiling with the bass traps on the sides and rear, bass traps in the corners, sound panels appropriately placed and even specified where to place the rugs and seating within inches, etc. Then I used a variety of test cd's with the Radio Shack SPL meter as well as measuring distances and laser directions, etc. Very basic I know, like I said I'm no pro, but I think It's fairly close. [as a side note, I think the money spent with Rives Audio was well worth it for me as I'm still learning as I go]

It's going to be a couple of months before I move, so I've got some time to figure out what's best. On the other hand, this information may prove very useful in selecting my next dwelling i.e., I may be searching for the perfect room instead of the most appropriate home...

Another good thread to start... "What is the perfect room?"

Thanks for all the great info - keep it coming! It's great that it's free, cause the cost of ignorance and poor decisions can be high!

[schaefer11]

Originally Posted by jdandy

ZenZoo.......My recommendation to purchase the MC501 amps before the speakers was based on your stated budget of $6K to $8K. I felt that, even at the $8K mark, your budget would not support the caliber of speakers you might seek to rise to the level of your source.

There is no denying that speakers offer the largest variable in your system's sound, and implementing accurate physical actions is always a greater challenge than implementing accurate electronic actions. A speakers sound, and the way you hear that sound are more subjective than any other part of an audio system. Obviously, the choice of speakers is extremely important, but I did not feel an $8K budget would get you in the ballpark with speakers, and that's why I chose the amps first.

Well, I am finding quite rapidly that I may own McIntosh equipment, but I am out of my league as a Mcintosh owner. In just a few short days I have learned that a 6 thousand dollar McIntosh DVD player sounds like a blanket is over the speakers and that $8000 per pair speakers are not good enough to sound good with a Mac DAC. Yikes!

[schaefer11]

Originally Posted by ZenZoo

It's nice to get home from work and have so much great information from you guys to think about and consider.

To respond to some of the previous comments... yea, I'm still on a budget and agree that in the $6K range I could find a good used pair of 501's, but to get speakers I'd truly be happy with and take a big step up from my B&W 703's, I figured I'd have to spend $8-$12K or more. Now if I could find the Wilson Sophia 2's or similar around the $6K range, I'd probably choose those instead. I'm certainly going to look into the Rocky Mountain Audio Fest to see if that's possible. I have wanted to go to CES in Vegas for years, but always have work conflicts with other shows at that time. Granted, that's more electronics than audiophile equipment...

As for room treatment and speaker set-up, I'd say I'm 85% there! I'm certainly not a professional and have never used a Audio Control RTA or the like (although I'm interested in learning), but I did pay for consulting from Rives audio who designed my room to the square inch and gave detailed instructions on how to build the soffit in the ceiling with the bass traps on the sides and rear, bass traps in the corners, sound panels appropriately placed and even specified where to place the rugs and seating within inches, etc. Then I used a variety of test cd's with the Radio Shack SPL meter as well as measuring distances and laser directions, etc. Very basic I know, like I said I'm no pro, but I think It's fairly close. [as a side note, I think the money spent with Rives Audio was well worth it for me as I'm still learning as I go]

It's going to be a couple of months before I move, so I've got some time to figure out what's best. On the other hand, this information may prove very useful in selecting my next dwelling i.e., I may be searching for the perfect room instead of the most appropriate home...

Another good thread to start... "What is the perfect room?"

Thanks for all the great info - keep it coming! It's great that it's free, cause the cost of ignorance and poor decisions can be high!

The work you did on room set up is far beyond basic and I suspect you are in fact getting everything your speakers have to offer. That makes me doubly convinced that looking for speakers would be the way to go to make a major impact. But you may want to wait until you are in the new place. Having your current speakers in the new room will give you a proper starting point to find what you think you need to improve upon. What you need to improve in the current room will have little to do with the new room.

[Still-One]

Originally Posted by schaefer11

Well, I am finding quite rapidly that I may own McIntosh equipment, but I am out of my league as a Mcintosh owner. In just a few short days I have learned that a 6 thousand dollar McIntosh DVD player sounds like a blanket is over the speakers and that $8000 per pair speakers are not good enough to sound good with a Mac DAC. Yikes!

What, hyperbole is not allowed here. You own very fine McIntosh gear. You have chosen to allocate your funds to include video where others have not. If you were only purchasing for a 2 channel set up today would you allocate more towards speakers? By the way, didn't you notice we love helping others spend their money.

Actually you can get excellent speakers for $8k and that $6k all-format player plays and sounds great even if it does not have the latest DAC's for audio playback.
Jim

[ZenZoo]

Originally Posted by schaefer11

Well, I am finding quite rapidly that I may own McIntosh equipment, but I am out of my league as a Mcintosh owner. In just a few short days I have learned that a 6 thousand dollar McIntosh DVD player sounds like a blanket is over the speakers and that $8000 per pair speakers are not good enough to sound good with a Mac DAC. Yikes!

Very interesting comment... I'm not sure I follow you... are you saying that the MacDAC is wonderful but that you would have to get a really high-end speaker to do it justice? And the same goes for their DVD Player... i.e, that their electronics are just "that" good!

Thanks for the comments on the work I did in my room. It was all DIY, but it came out really nice and the room actually sounds pretty good! Now I'll have to do it all over again. Well, it should keep me busy and out of trouble for a while.

[schaefer11]

Originally Posted by ZenZoo

Very interesting comment... I'm not sure I follow you... are you saying that the MacDAC is wonderful but that you would have to get a really high-end speaker to do it justice? And the same goes for their DVD Player... i.e, that their electronics are just "that" good!

Thanks for the comments on the work I did in my room. It was all DIY, but it came out really nice and the room actually sounds pretty good! Now I'll have to do it all over again. Well, it should keep me busy and out of trouble for a while.

Actually, it was jdandy that said $8000 speakers might not do your DAC justice. I was reacting to his comment and an earlier comment by someone, maybe on a different thread, that when he compared his MVP871 to his newer MCD(?)500 CD player that it sounded like a blanket was removed from his speakers with the 500.

[jdandy]

Originally Posted by schaefer11

Well, I am finding quite rapidly that I may own McIntosh equipment, but I am out of my league as a Mcintosh owner. In just a few short days I have learned that a 6 thousand dollar McIntosh DVD player sounds like a blanket is over the speakers and that $8000 per pair speakers are not good enough to sound good with a Mac DAC. Yikes!

schaefer11........

You have a very respectable system. In particular, the LS360's are excellent, and revered by many owners who would not dream of parting with them. Were McIntosh to produce that same speaker today I feel certain it would be in the $12 to $14K price range. My comment to ZenZoo about speaker cost was centered on new speaker prices, not what may or may not be available on the use market at any given time.

[Masterlu]

Originally Posted by jdandy

schaefer11........

You have a very respectable system. In particular, the LS360's are excellent, and revered by many owners who would not dream of parting with them. Were McIntosh to produce that same speaker today I feel certain it would be in the $12 to $14K price range. My comment to ZenZoo about speaker cost was centered on new speaker prices, not what may or may not be available on the use market at any given time.

Indeed they are! I just bought two dot's mint LS360's in Cherry. Not quite sure where they will go, but at least I know I have them.

[PHC1]

I think a good analogy in terms of speakers and amps and which comes first is if one was shopping for a horse and carriage. First you pick out a nice comfortable carriage that pleases you, then you find a good strong horse to pull the carriage... Oh, yeah, the carriage is the speakers.