Legacy Wavelet II

[SCAudiophile]

FYI...found an email from 2015 when I was first shopping around with Swagman Labs, Uptone, Pardo, HDPlex and others for someone willing to build a suitable power supply. This quote is from Bill at Legacy:

"The universal power supply unit we provide with Wavelet is rated 12 VDC, 5.0Amp, 65 watts.

If you are looking for a regulated power supply in external chassis, the Wavelet requires 12-13.8 Volts DC, the 13.x V number being boundary testing, 60 watts minimum."

[SCAudiophile]

Questions asked over on my system thread so copying the answers here if anyone needs them...

As soon as you can, get an LPSU in there that supplies the necessary volts and amps and put the "wall wart" that comes with Wavelet back in the box. The sonic result is worth the extra expense of upgrading to an LPSU and better umbilical.

I've had 3 Legacy setups that used Wavelet going back years; with each one I have ordered an HDPLEX LPSU and umbilical. The result is always the same; the wall wart is sonically "not good" and I'm being kind.
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"The universal power supply unit we provide with Wavelet is rated 12 VDC, 5.0Amp, 65 watts.

If you are looking for a regulated power supply in external chassis, the Wavelet requires 12-13.8 Volts DC, the 13.x V number being boundary testing, 60 watts minimum."

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More detail:

The DC umbilical from an LPSU needs to take your LPSU's output pin spec and plug type into consideration however the input to Wavelet is always 5-pin XLR known as XLR5.

For an HDPLEX 300W LPSU which I highly recommend and personally use:

(Source Output) HDPlex LPSU Out: XLR3 3pin XLR FEMALE plug on cable, pin-2 is +VDC, pin-1 is GND, pin-3 is unused

(Destination Input): Legacy Audio Wavelet In: XLR5 5-pin XLR FEMALE plug on cable, pin-5 is +VDC, pin-3 is GND, other pins (1,2,4) are unused

So we have Pin-2 on XLR3 FEMALE at source going to Pin-5 on XLR5 FEMALE at destination for +VDC, Pin-1 on XLR3 source going to Pin-3 on XLR5 for GND

*Know your LPSU and what connector it uses and ask the manufacturer the pin-out mapping so that you can determine a source LPSU -> Wavelet cable spec like the one above.

In the case of my setup, I have two different DC umbilicals for historical reasons, both of extreme quality:

- Revelation Audio Labs DC CryoSilver Reference Umbilical

- Ghent Audio: “Custom DC-7N16C Neotech UPOCC 7N Copper G DC(JSSG360) Cable Length: 3m, XLR female(3pin XLR3) to XLR female(5pin, XLR5)

Hope this helps.

My advice is LPSU straight to the wall and use an Shunyata Omega QR-s, OR using a Shunyata Alpha NR v2 or Sigma NR v2 either straight to the wall or into something like a Shunyata Triton v3 or Denali 6000 v2 or Everest.

Any other high quality power cord or conditioner can also be used.

HDPLEX frequently go out and then back into stock as they are one of the best and most popular out there...

[MatthewB]

Currently listening to an LP by the Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra (made in West Germany in 1984) on a Linn Sondek LP12 through the Valors. It sounds pretty good. I must admit that I have never had satisfactory experience of orchestral music on any speaker prior to the Valors, including the Aeris.

[SCAudiophile]

Originally Posted by MatthewB

Currently listening to an LP by the Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra (made in West Germany in 1984) on a Linn Sondek LP12 through the Valors. It sounds pretty good. I must admit that I have never had satisfactory experience of orchestral music on any speaker prior to the Valors, including the Aeris.

I share your opinion...not even the mighty TAD R1s that I have also owned and loved can fully resolve grand symphonic and large pipe organ works in their full splendor as well as full detail simultaneously. Many other famous brands' top models also get one or the other mostly or fully right to my hearing but not both.

Add to the the fact that Valor can play the smallest, sparcest and most delicate of instruments or voices alone or in small ensembles with the delicateness and dexterity and beauty of the best monitor speakers I've ever heard driven by a great SET amp and you have a truly unique speaker in the world.

And...they absolutley rock out with the best of them too [emoji2]

[SCAudiophile]

@MatthewB

To answer a few of your questions

- as I mentioned briefly before, of all the Legacy speakers I've owned over many years, the Valor are unique in that they perform best with very little toe-in. This I believe due to a couple of things including the SUT (Omnio when engaged) array itself and more importantly the compound driver array and first of its kind tweeter array. When I first heard Valor many years ago when it first came out, I moved around the listening area and also listened across the front of each speaker while moving slowly from left to right a couple feet in front of the larger concentric driver array. It was a Legacy session for the Atlanta audio society and I asked Bill afterwards if it was my imagination or if the inward firing (towards listener) and outward firing AMT modules were playing common as well as slightly different info each. He said that was in fact the case...don't know how they pull that little miracle off however the outboard AMT plays signal intended directionally for the listening position more so while the outboard firing AMT plays a bit different info that is meant to more accurately create the overall room as it were. As a result the typical things required with many speakers that perform best with toe-in that can be drastic or in the case of the Legacy's I've owned and the TAD R1's, aiming the tweeter modules (and thus speaker centerline) on a line that converges behind the listener's head for a foot or more (according to speaker, room dimensions, listening position, etc...does not seem warranted and in fact does not perform as well at all with Valor (tried once,....did not care for it at all). My Valor have very slight toe-in but it is definitely not "zero"

- I always work to get Aeris, Valor, etc. regardless of use of Wavelet or not to sound and image on all my reference tracks in all dimensions at their best before running room setup. In short, I take Wavelet out of the signal path except to use it as the crossover it needs to be but with nothing else engaged. We all have our favorite discs for center imaging, front to back depth, left to right and other panning, listener surrounding effects, etc...I make sure I get this as close to perfect sans all the RoomEQ, Omnio in this case with Valor. Then and only then did I do my first set of sweeps. About 2 months ago, just for good measure as I'd gotten a new digital front-end stack and pre-amp, after they were fully broken in and I was hearing so much more detail, imaging, etc., I disengaged Wavelet and did it all over again from manual speaker setup forward and found with a few tweaks I was able to discern more and improve things much more than I thought. Then I ran the setup routines again and got back to a calibrated setup...

- Contours after the fact: I have several configured however I have 1 baseline contour set stored in memory that covers 70% of material or more. The other 2 are variations of the first one with less of one or two things to compensate for particular hot/bright recordings...

- Contours with V2 versus V1: I'm finding much less tweaking and increasing or decreasing certain bands is necessary than it was with V1...

- RoomEQ: always have it engaged which is pretty obvious

- Omnio: Use it for vast majority of records however when a recording is done with QSound or other modern technique for crafty encoding and enhancement of spatial and "those cool effects", or the studio has added reverb of any appreciable amount, I found what's on the disc is best and I disengage Omnio as "stacking" the mixing tricks and Omnio together is not for the best result. Either one or the other depending upon the recording engineer

- Apodizing DAC: with a SOTA DAC array upstream (Estoeric Grandioso D1s) and also the uplift in quality and capability of the DACs and 64-bit DSP in Wavelet V2, my preference is to have Apodizing DAC now turned off 100% of the time. With Wavelet V1, I needed it on all the time to smooth the effects of the still very capable but v1 older DSP

- positioning: Distance from side walls to the center line of front baffle is 2.5 ft plus a bit. Distance from back wall to center line of front baffle is 4.5-4.6 feet, very slight toe-in. Speakers on 8 foot centerline separation. Listening position a few inches short of 10 feet back... Valor and all other Legacy speakers love room to breathe; wish my room was bigger so I could pull 'em out further!

- Difference between V2 and V1 SUT (Omnio): I've mentioned all that I will post publicly as I've seen this sort of thing trend negatively for manufacturers on this and other forums. One person's candidly conveyed personal observations and preferences turn into perceived flaws or shortcomings and a ding to the vendor's reputation particularly those who build products that reviewers and owners will come right out in public view and cite great performance and equal or superior sound to the fan-boy / industry "faves" and big names. Frankly after 30+ years chasing gear I am tired of certain forces & people out there taking umbrage with a quality speaker from <insert strong performing brand with great ROI here> performing equal and perhaps even more musically and "SOTA" than a more expensive, more fawned over brand....

I am very happy to talk in more detail on specifics via phone....feel free to hit me upon with an IM and we can talk soon....

[MatthewB]

@SCAudiophile

Thank you for this information. I may take you up on your offer to chat. However, it will probably be a while.

I currently have a Plixir Elite BDC on order (72 watts). The manufacturer will also provide a custom umbilical for the Wavelet as part of the order. I would be plugging this directly into a PS Audio Power Regenerator. It will be interesting to see what this does to the sound quality of the system.

It's always hard determining what makes sense as the next step to make when it comes to upgrading. Something I am thinking about is upgrading my turntable to the Klimax level. The idea of a tube amp for the treble section also sounds interesting, but then one gets the hassle of heat generation, and having to replace tubes. I do like to keep my system simple, which also reduces the desirability of getting a tube amp.

I do think that I need to wait a while, so that I can get used to the current setup. Otherwise, it will feel that I am never done.

[SCAudiophile]

Originally Posted by MatthewB

@SCAudiophile

Thank you for this information. I may take you up on your offer to chat. However, it will probably be a while.

I currently have a Plixir Elite BDC on order (72 watts). The manufacturer will also provide a custom umbilical for the Wavelet as part of the order. I would be plugging this directly into a PS Audio Power Regenerator. It will be interesting to see what this does to the sound quality of the system.

It's always hard determining what makes sense as the next step to make when it comes to upgrading. Something I am thinking about is upgrading my turntable to the Klimax level. The idea of a tube amp for the treble section also sounds interesting, but then one gets the hassle of heat generation, and having to replace tubes. I do like to keep my system simple, which also reduces the desirability of getting a tube amp.

I do think that I need to wait a while, so that I can get used to the current setup. Otherwise, it will feel that I am never done.

Best advice is get 350-500 hours on Valor and Wavelet v2 and see the beginnings of what they are truly capable of and other than the LPSU, don't touch a thing for a while.

Once you break in speakers and V2 fully, run the sweeps and RoomEQ calcs again...

And...enjoy the ride!

[SCAudiophile]

One other unaswered question....I haven't tried tubes on the top end of my speakers yet (mine allow separate amps for mids and treble). Sure it would sound wonderful,however I probably won't do it due to temporal issues slower tube gear compared to built the built in amps' type, and the damping factor differences between the 2 types of amps will bring.

[MatthewB]

@SCAudiophile

I generally need to hear the system before a purchase. To me, synergy is key. When I demoed the Aeris at the factory, I brought my record player (and table), power amp, laptop, cables, etc, and set it all up at the factory. Yep. I brought a spirit level to level the table for my Linn Sondek LP12. My power amp sounded like rubbish compared to the PowerBlock 2, so I went full active with ICE modules (used in the PowerBlock 2).

From what I can tell, Raven tube amps have been used with the Valor in a number of shows. Bascom King also mentioned that listening to the Wavelet with Valor was an ear opening experience. This was at Destination HiFi in Los Angeles. Not sure if he was using a tube amp. This tells me that the Valors can work well with a tube amp.

When it comes round to a tube amp comparison, I will probably fly over to LA to have a listen. If the improvement is significant, I may bite the bullet.

[SCAudiophile]

Originally Posted by MatthewB

@SCAudiophile

I generally need to hear the system before a purchase. To me, synergy is key. When I demoed the Aeris at the factory, I brought my record player (and table), power amp, laptop, cables, etc, and set it all up at the factory. Yep. I brought a spirit level to level the table for my Linn Sondek LP12. My power amp sounded like rubbish compared to the PowerBlock 2, so I went full active with ICE modules (used in the PowerBlock 2).

From what I can tell, Raven tube amps have been used with the Valor in a number of shows. Bascom King also mentioned that listening to the Wavelet with Valor was an ear opening experience. This was at Destination HiFi in Los Angeles. Not sure if he was using a tube amp. This tells me that the Valors can work well with a tube amp.

When it comes round to a tube amp comparison, I will probably fly over to LA to have a listen. If the improvement is significant, I may bite the bullet.

I take the same approach...must listen first before committing a purchase. In the case of Valor, I heard it 5 times over a multiyear period and made sure I also heard hundreds of other speakers wherever I could and culminating with Munich High End 2019....it was clear after that,...Valor prevailed for me.

Would love to hear what you think when you hear the combo with tubes.

As I said, I'm sure it will be wonderful sounding....without a doubt. Raven, VAC, West End Audio Munich, NAT Magma and many other names I have heard and love, would be on my candidate list. My other comments are my personal preferences alone and towards the underlying differences that I've found impact music that I must have perform as I know it can after the beautiful tones and glow of tube effects on the audio presentation are experienced and I start listening deeper and beyond the initial effect. More on specifics of what I mean when we can connect.