You're exactly right there. While I obviously believe the built-in filtering in our products is second-to-none, there's no such thing as a perfect brick wall when it comes to incoming voltage. We even make the L-5 to provide additional power filtering using similar technology to the built-in filtering for that reason (and to help the non-Ayre gear). Depending on how much noise is on the line, you can certainly hear an improvement by adding a filter, though oddly, sometimes removing them helps too.

At our old building, we were in the center of a pretty industrial area and had to have everything hooked into L-5s to get the room to sound its best. Our new area is in a more remote location and doesn't have to share with as many neighbors. Suddenly, reserving the L-5s for only the non-Ayre pieces in our system provided a better sound than having everything running through them. The difficulty is that each room and each listener is different, so some experimentation is involved. The only constant we've experienced is to stay clear of power "regenerators". They almost always end up causing more problems than they are meant to solve for us. We feel the less active the filter is, the better job it will do. Of course, your mileage may vary.

My (strong) recommendation would be to get a Shunyata Denali 6000 or Triton. I’ve tried the PPP regenerator before, and my entry level Hydra 4 significantly surpassed it with respect to sound quality. A Denali or Triiton is at least another order of magnitude beyond that; if not more, and I mean that empirically (as in actual data, I haven’t done the math on it, but if I need to, I will! :D)

:thumbsup: Bang on.

It's NOT needed. All amplifiers have some filtering and regulation built in. High performance amplifiers from brands like Ayre already do a satisfactory job taking care of power idiosyncracies. Adding an external type conditioner would be redundant in most cases and detrimental in others. However, it may benefit other lesser performing devices as Ryan alluded to previously. For people that choose them... so be it, for people that don't... no worries!

I have (2) Shunyata Alpha HC power cords for my Ayre MXR amps, feeding into a High Fidelity Hemisphere power conditioner (powered by a High Fidelity PRO power cord).


https://live.staticflickr.com/7848/3...dc119baa_b.jpg

It’s worth noting that a good power system (cables and conditioner) doesn’t just filter the power being delivered to the amplifier, but also should filter any noise generated by the amplifier which might affect other components. See the Component-to Component Interference section from Shunyata’s technology guide page here: https://shunyata.com/technology-guide/

Bingo. Also any EMI generated by unshielded power cords, e.g. for lamps, CD players, music servers, or the high bandwidth CPUs in tablets, phones, music servers, computers, Squeezeboxes, etc.

Although you make an important point it is outside the scope of this thread. To reitterate Ayre equipment will not directly benefit from an external line conditioner. Now lets examine your point.

Enthusiasts tend to care about what's "on the line"? So it's unlikely that anyone here would knowingly drop their expensive gear on the same circuit that is shared by other non-compliant devices. So what is a non-compliant device? Anything that is not part of the audio system. The optimal way to achieve that is to run a dedicated circuit (aka "line"). This is a far more cost effective way to get clean power than any line conditioner on the planet could provide for component-to-component interference.

One could still argue that a separate line may improve the quality of the signal but that alone will not gaurantee that it will be clean (free from noise). True, but there is a very important point being overlooked here. Companies like Shunyata are looking on the AC side of power NOT the DC side. Power is isolated, filtered and recified when it is converted from AC to DC. Power conditioners do absolutely NOTHING for the DC signal that is generated within. But even well made equipment like Ayre can still generate inherent interference. Again true, but that's why companies like Ayre have the reputation they do because they take measures to isolate and shield those interferences thereby preserving the quality of the signal that is being manipulated and amplified.

Power conditioners do what they advertise but then so do companies like Ayre and they don't advertise it, they don't need to. It would be HIGHLY unfortunate if Ayre, and the like, had to depend on external line conditioners to make their products sound just as good at home as they perform on the bench. The fact of the matter is they absolutely do not!

Can you please tell us if you've actually made these measurements? If not, how can you be sure that what you state is factual?

In Post #11 didn't Ryan Berry, Ayre CEO, just say that under certain conditions the sound of their Ayre gear was improved through the use of additional external filtering (i.e., 'no perfect brick wall')? I am no expert, but one thing I think I've learned in this hobby is to stay away from 'absolutes.' In other words, YMMV.